Stuck bolts

Hi,

If these slotted head screws are large enough can you or can you get someone who can weld a nut to the top of them and then you can use a socket to try and undo them?

I was on a Jongert 25m about 25 yrs ago and we had to remove all deck hardware for a paint job, there were very few screws that came undone in the winches.

The ones that didn't were drilled out enough to get the winch base off and then ground flat flush with the steel foundation. Some of them were then able to be undone downwards with the aid of vice grips on the end that stuck out the bottom of the foundation for the rest a punch was used to make sure we could get going in the middle and the drilling started, they were progressively drilled with cobalt drills and Rocol cutting fluid. We only needed to go through about 10mm till we were as deep in the bolt as the foundation plate was thick. I don't remember any major problems other than extreme boredom of the repeated job and a mess from the swarf and cutting fluid.

"The April/May 2007 edition of Machinist's Workshop did a test of penetrating oils where they measured the force required to loosen rusty test devices.

Penetrating oil . Average load .. Price per fluid ounce
None ................. 516 pounds .
WD-40 .............. 238 pounds .. $0.25
PB Blaster ......... 214 pounds .. $0.35
Liquid Wrench ... 127 pounds .. $0.21
Kano Kroil ........ 106 pounds .. $0.75
ATF-Acetone mix.. 53 pounds .. $0.10

The ATF-Acetone mix was a 50/50 mix (1 to 1 ratio)."


My suggestion is to soak overnight with Kroil or the atf/acetone mix and then try all you wish with the stuff others have suggested.

Kroil is my usual go to (WD only for household cleaning, etc.) and have used ATF when that was all I had. The Acetone mix is a new one on me. Has anyone tried that with Kroil? And does anybody know where CRC would rate in that list?

Ah so ... they look like 5/16 slotted oval head machine screws. Are you sure they are threaded into SS and not aluminum?

You might be better off removing the mount the winch sits on and see what is behind those screws. At some point you will need to remove that large plate to access the hydraulic piping anyway - if it is hydraulic.

If they don't back out with a large screwdriver with a wrench persuader they might just twist off then you will have to grind them flat and drill but since they are so small that is no big deal, just make sure you have a good drill and bit and don't be afraid to get pushy and aggressive when drilling.

Hi,

It looks like an Alu plate that the winch is sitting on to me.

The dried yellow goo around the screw heads is probably Duralac

http://www.piplers.co.uk/1195/Dural...oogle&utm_medium=froogle&utm_campaign=pid1195

It isn't bad stuff and if it was used originally the screws might come out once you can get them to turn.

If you do as suggested earlier and find the best fitting screwdriver( even if you have to buy one) with a square shank also one where the handle goes all the way through you could try undoing the screws while someone else gives the top of the blade a few knocks with a hammer.

None of those screws look like they have had a good seeing to by Impact Driver either. Get a bit that is a good fit in the screws if using an impact driver and give the tool a good welly with a club or lump hammer. These tools are called Impact Drivers for the simple reason that they need a good Impact to drive. The beating not only produces a bit of a turning force it can also loosen up the contact area between screw and countersunk bore of hole.

Once you have hit the same knuckle with a hammer a few times in succession it doesn't hurt nearly as much as the first couple of blows.

Greetings,
I agree an impact driver, but wear a heavy glove (yup, I've done the knuckle deal). Since you're taking the winch off anyway, the use of a FINE flame shouldn't damage the paint too much, if at all.
Peter.

Please resize your pictures, they are really messing up the layout because they are too wide. I'm surprised none of the guardians have complained yet.

You only have to drill through the head, about a half inch at most and it will fall off.

Don't mess around, use the right tool for the job. There's got to be a tool rental place near you in the Chi area. Even HD or Lowe's. Rent a real tool for the morning.

Can we have a look at a photo of the entire area, I suspect that the smartest thing to do is remove the switch and using a torch and mirror have a look inside the cavity.

Greetings,
Nope, NOT a propane torch-too broad a flame. Fine oxy-acetalyne tip.
Peter

Hi,

If my memory serves me correctly there is not a hole under those switches anywhere near the size of the switch.

Three inches of bolt? Are there any exposed threads on the inside? If there are you can use two jam nuts and a wrench to help remove them without damaging the threads.

Still haven't heard if the winch is electric or hydraulic. It appears that it may be electric and the reason it sits on that raised white platform is because it is driven by a horizontally mounted motor. If that is the case then removing those machine screws around the black base of the winch will do nothing for you.

Concentrate on removing the bolts or screws that secure the white plate to the motor housing. If I am not mistaken, this plate will carry the winch, motor, and switch and you will just have a couple of large wires between the motor controller and a penetration inside the deck housing.

I'm not convinced the light structure is up to being beaten by one of those hammer operated impact wrenches, it will probably deform before the fastener comes loose. Just bite the bullet and heat the screw heads holding the flat white plate to the housing and accept the fact you will need to paint it later, it looks corroded anyway. There are probably nuts holding the winch base to that plate and even if you could get them off easily, the winch isn't going anywhere with the motor still attached.

Probably a good idea.

Its been a long time since I pulled a Lewmar deck switch but I pulled a Maxwell about 2 weeks ago.

If that is really true then it is among the most bizarre construction I have heard of. It is not normal practice to thread both the plate and the flange and then add a nut for good measure. Perhaps you have mistaken the products of corrosion for threaded holes?

The top plate should have a clearance drilled hole. The flange may or may not be threaded depending on its thickness. If it is as thin as the cover then it too would be clearance drilled and a nut installed on the fastener when there is access to the opposite side. If there is no access, a blind nut might be installed or studs welded to the lower housing with nuts on the upper part. Blind nuts in aluminum are a bad idea when the parts are thin and subject to corrosion like your winch base.

How did the builder expect someone to access nuts from outside the mount?