Salvage of the Nordhavn EYF that sunk in Mexico

We live in different worlds. Many yachts of this size use no captain or hire a per diem captain. I know as many captains that I would never consider to be anything close to an engineer, as I do engineers that I'd never let dock a boat or plot a course. I know enough to do this install, but I would never do it because there are those who do it day in and day out. I'd expect them to do it better, and I'd depend on their expertise.

OK, in Europe you can find owner operated yachts up to about 80 feet, then you usually have a captain/engineer up to about 100 feet and then you find both a captain and an engineer onboard.

"... the item was installed and as a result, the boat sank."

One last attempt - the item was installed, the boat sank.

Those are the only truths you are in a position to know. It is wrong to insinuate that Mexican workers did a bad job and the boat sank as a result.

Same here. This was a 75'.

Don't even know if the workers were Mexican, but the installers were the only ones known to have had a hand in this. So that's a pretty good place for where to start the questions. That there was a captain or engineer supervising the work or that any owners rep is responsible for an installer's mistake is irresponsible. That's like me having my roof repaired and it being my fault when the rain pours in a day later because I should have known they did a lousy job.

Hi,

Before any fufu Valves are blown can anyone say with any certainty that it the install of the Tuna Tubes actually had anything to do with the lead up to the sinking?

It may well be that these boats have pitifully small bilge pumps , the install of some extra hull fittings might have had nothing at all to do with the problems that made sink it, it could have flooded by a lot of other means and the mickey mouse bilge system was unable to cope.

Again,

"...too many 'ifs' for anything but speculation ..."

Then why do you keep insisting that the boat sank as a result of an item being installed?

And please, spare us the coy games ... when you asked about saving money by not going to Seattle or Fort Lauderdale you implied that the workmanship in Mexico was not up to some standard.

"Coy games"? Have you read how many if's and inuendos you included in your posts here. The only thing difinitive in your posts was you're attempt to blame a captain that you don't even know exists. My statement related to this statement:

Could undersized bilge pumps have contributed to the sinking? I don't know, but the water had to come in before the pumps could fail to keep up. Maybe a marlin spiked the bottom of the boat. I don't know. But it's been stated that tuna tubes were just installed and that's more likely the source than a marlin. Do I think you can get good work done in Mexico or China or anyplace else? Sure. I also feel that your odds of getting the best work done are in the U.S., but that will cost more. Guess I'm biased. I believe in the American work ethic.

If there was a paid "professional" captain on board it is his / her responsibility to ensure that the vessel is in a safe & seaworthy condition. A real captain could do this job, a bus driver could not.

Some how that yacht got from the the west coast, to Florida and down to Mexico and none of the so called experts realized that the bilge pumps were in-adequate and when a major hole was put thru' the bottom of the boat the professionals did not seem to think it may be a good idea to close off a sea cock while they went to a bar.

I guess besides the bilge pumps not working the galley was not as appealing to a crew than a bar in Mexico.

If, if's & and's were pot's & pan's there would be no need for tinker's.

None of us know for sure what happened but maybe it is a lesson to all that a watch should always be maintained and especially when new equipment is installed whether it be in Mexico or up the New River in Fort Lauderdale. ( I have seen many sinkings in this town thanks to mistakes being made by the white folk ?)

There are a whole lot of assumptions here and no facts. Nobody really knows what happened, who was on the boat, or even supposed to be on the boat, or what really caused the sinking at this point......All anyone knows, is a bait pump was recently installed and the boat sank.

Hi,

Hasn't that gone the way of the Dinosaurs ?

Where ever a job is being done on your boat you need to check that no matter who is doing it that the work is carried out correctly. If you don't know how to check it yourself engage someone who does. This includes specifying and building the thing in the first place.

A lot of the accidents/broken things and duffers that the likes of Yachtjocky, Marmot and the rest of us encounter can be traced back to a point where there has been a total lack of what should be common sense to those that are demanding the big bucks, single cabins and a 1 on 1 off rotation if they are half as good as they think they are.

This is not something that is just confined to the smaller end of the yachting scale but is spread throughout the industry.

Do you mean the "work ethic" that can't even attribute a quote correctly?

"it has been said that a boat yard in Mexico installed it that week, and used the wrong hose size or fitting size and the bait pump left a 2" (thru-hull) opening in the bottom of the boat."

Look that one up before you try to use it as an example of whatever you are trying to say.

And give us all a break, stop squirming long enough to admit your Seattle/Fort Lauderdale/save money statement was an attempt to denigrate the Mexican yard. Stop trying to make it a fact that the installation caused the sinking.

We don't know if something failed, or if it did fail if it was because of bad workmanship or if the job was even finished and who decided it was OK to leave for the night in whatever condition it was left.

As a general rule, yard workers do not open or close skin valves on a floating vessel without permission and knowledge of the captain or owner's rep. Again, your tiny boat culture is coloring how you look at the world.

Definition of DUFFER (Merriam-Webster)

: a peddler especially of cheap flashy articles b : something counterfeit or worthless

: an incompetent, ineffectual, or clumsy person; especially : a mediocre golfer

Australian : a cattle rustler

I take great offense at that characterization, young man. I do not play golf!

Hi,

This sums up a number of individuals who sprang to mind when I wrote that, I was not thinking of you, me or YJ as being amongst the herd which is why I wrote it the way I did.

American Work Ethic

Thankfully only at the top end of business. And again, not that there aren't slouches here and good workers elsewhere. There's a new show on TV called Undercover Boss. It would benefit every employer to watch. Every CEO and even the Mayor of Cincinnati, who went undercover in their own companies, so far have come away with new found respect and compassion for their workers. It's more than a cliche'. And before anyone thinks it's a race or national origin thing, there was a couple on last week who were from El Salvador. Anyone would be proud to be their parent or child. We're a melting pot. There's just something about our culture that fosters pride in one's work, even at the lowliest levels.

I will acknowledge many of the other failings but the golf thing is going too far!

I've also seen a lot of very qualified engineers make mistakes also. Everyone forgets something once in a while. I've seen hose clamps forgotten on one raw water pump once, I've seen the watermaker piss freshwater out of the overflow first thing in the morning because someone forgot to shut it down before they went to sleep. People are human, and critical things should always be double checked.