Publishing of original concept designs?

OK guys ... or guys and gals ... be careful with the wordings. Stick to the topic and refrain from any personal mudslinging. Remember - your membership is at stake ...

Stick to the topic!

Bjorn

Marmot

Those words often seem true, don't they. More often (in the one vs many scenario), specially in today's environment perhaps, because the artist(s) don't know they have been copied, or they don't have the resources to do anything about it, or they don't have the will to go forward with any counter action.

But I strongly believe it is still the individual's responsibility to do one's best to create original or unique design/detail/lines/concepts even if based on "inspiration" from another's original work. It is not OK to purposefully copy a detail or a whole from another, but rather "steal" the idea(s) and make something new and fresh from the idea.

Of course - some design similies may just be accidental 'copies' since often ideas may be the influences of current/past times or fashions. But sometimes individuals seem to lack the pure effort it takes to create unique works by instead lazily and openly stealing someone elses elements - like in the case of AMG vs "down-under".

Designing is not just fun ... it is also a serious moral and legal responsibility. However, there are always those few unscrupulous ones who give no thought about rights and intellectual property at all.

Bjorn

Blarp

I have always thought direct targeting/marketing would be the way to go. I have already tried it by approaching builders and a few designers at trade shows. The builders general consensus were that they have very little clout over who the client/owner will pick as a designer, but they are happy to keep your name on file. Designers are - well - your business competition. And it may also be that owners go with whomever is fashionable or popular at the time, or they get referrals from other owners.

My personal beef is how to find the right door(s) and direct connection(s) to potential owners without having to publish or rely only on the www. In the end - the owners are the only ones making the decisions whether they like your work or not, and they need to see your work first hand to make those decisions.

Owners may also struggle to find new and potential great talent and concepts that have not been actively published in print or on the www.

Now --- YOU --- the independent designers --- lurking and reading this thread, who may have been in this situation before, and who already have made your first contact "catching" an owner and making 'that' deal for a superyacht or similar --- do you have a story or two to relay to this community about your experiences?????

Bjorn

Lars ...... you are a brave northern soul for "trusting" your work to the far east connection. I see you are not holding your breath over it, but still. I have friends from and in that region, and I am constantly being told by them -- unless you look and speak local, they will not easily do business with you --- if at all. Period. Many outsiders find local representatives to be the front person to even be able to "open" the door.

Also, in the area you are referring to, there is enormous distrust over 'Guai Lo' = people like you and me. And knowing what regard there is over copyrights and related protection over there, I must say again - you are a seriously brave man.

Bjorn

Marmot

True. But heart stopping dangerous - business wise - to put it out there before it has been made. Think Apple - never published or releasing anything until the product is shipping or has been protected in some form. Other companies let the product out of the bag sometimes months upon months in advance, and often get ripped off before they get to launch their own.

Yes - form certainly follows function - a logical train of thought. However, there are unlimited ways an artist can make the design unique, yet still be 100% functional. One may think there are only a finite number of ways to make a musical piece with only an octave available (8 notes from C to C, and 5 sharps), but look at the amazing, great and seemingly endless variety of original musical content that has been created over the centuries. Modern yacht design can certainly be done in more different ways than what one finds floating inside any marina today, and the designers should and must be more creative with the ways form meets function. Not everything has to look a certain way just because it is going to float on water or sail through a wave. If not the visionaries and artists - no paper clips, no Hubble space telescope, no Bugatti Veyron, and no 21st century computer chips (although the latter probably came from the pencil necked 'greys').

Agree ... to a certain extent. I think it is still the designer's ethical and moral role to not just tweak someone elses work and thereby just barely getting away with it in a potential court of law, but rather make it unique even when basing it on another's work. IMHO.

Love the Pollack comparison. I think he never left his childhood though. Interesting work. But what a slap in the face to the established fine art world it was at the time. Like the urinal installations of others.

Yes, one can not protect the wheel on the bridge, that a ship has propellers, or that the hull is white. But one can certainly protect elements or looks that as parts or as a whole contribute to a products total appearance, function or both. It is a somewhat grey area legally speaking because of weak copyright and intellectual laws world wide, but hopefully that changes to the designers benefits sooner than later. Otherwise - who would want to make music or art anymore if one can not get the necessary protection to keep making unique 'things'? Legal protection, but also a collective global indoctrination that theft and direct copying is not acceptable in any form.

I know, I know ... the place I live is called Utopia ...

Bjorn

Your copyright extends to any copy or potentially likeness of said design - on paper or otherwise - in the civilized world. If "pretty" art and graphics on paper or digital files can not be protected - how do you think patents are filed?

Nonsense. But one has to show that the idea was yours to begin with. And that goes both ways.

Bjorn

Blarp

My kind of guy. You just walked in and got the job for the asking. Nice.

You are correct that my approach would be more in the direction of larger one-offs and direct interaction with the client. It fits better in my end of the world.

Yes, it is all about the team effort. The lead designer or concept artist usually gets the public credit. Which is fair. And the profile of a yacht may be the most important feature. The client is often likely to go for a design because of a profile that is appealing. That would of course depend a little on the function and purpose of the vessel, but like with so many products made - it is most often the profile, the exterior "gloss", and the pride factor of exterior styling of most products that sells.

Regarding evolution of design - I briefly touched upon the issue in post #9 (with AMG). The intention with this thread is to try to clarify the issue of posting original concepts on the web or not, but the issues get a little side tracked now and then. But it is your chicken and egg scenario that comes into play. Issues regarding copyrights, what is original design or not, and the issues that are ostensibly connected with designers and unique art. I am not trying to take any high road, but just trying to find fair answers and have a good conversation in the process.

That we all contribute to the collective is fine and good. However, I assume that you - like me - don't physically live in such a dull grey industrial and political regime where no individual gets diligent support and due credit in the form of proper mention and serious remuneration for being such a bright head in the ocean of "grey" designer heads. Teamwork and co-operation has to be present at all times, but credit needs to go where it should go when design leaders step forth with ideas and direction. And if you yourself have created original art, don't you ever give up on your right to claim your art to be yours and yours only, and that you are proud of it as well.

Bjorn

Marmot

So .. are you saying that a one-off piece of art has no copyright protection? Or that perhaps one has to go into serial production or create the same looks for everything to receive legal protection? I hope that is not your reasoning, because it would not hold any water in a legal dispute.

BTW ... concept sketches are as good as gold in the court of law. And stealing is stealing - whatever the form of the original presentation. Courtcases have been won because of designs that was jotted down on a piece of napkin in a bar.

Bjorn