Fatal boating incident with alleged overloaded 34' Silverton

I'm sure there are stability experts on here who could better answer this. That said, it's possible. A boat with an already high center of mass could well be made unstable with an additional 3300 above it's center of mass. Ship stability is a highly complex consideration. Here's just one primer I found: Stability and Trim for Ships, Boats, Yachts and Barges ? Part I

It doesn't mean that the boat loaded like described will capsize. However, it does mean that it makes the boat easier to capsize.

That model only weighs about 12,500 (dry).

I understand the argument about manufactures providing load recommendations but ... Hypothetical newbie post.

"I just bought a new yacht. It a 34' silverton Flybridge sedan and I'm planning on taking about 25-30 people out to see the fireworks. Although the boat is new my brother in-law and I have plenty of boating experience. Any recommendations on the best place to anchor to see the fireworks?"

And what would the response be on this forum?

In front of the television.

the "captain" was not given the proper tools to determine the safe loading for the boat he was operating. If there is no placard, and the "captain" is not trained on basic vessel stability (and very few non-professionals are) then a reasonable man might well be led to a disaster



Again, I respectfully disagree. All the placards in the world would not have prevented this foreseeable tragedy. It was the captain's poor decisions - he willingly put 10 lbs of tomatos into a 5 lb bag.

But the very good point NYCAP made is that absent any advice on how big the bag is, he should not be condemned for lacking the information required to operate within an unpublished or undisclosed "limit."

In all honesty, how many boat operators know what GM means much what it is on the vessel they operate at the beginning and end of a voyage? How many readers here right now know where the VCG is on their boat with reference to the waterline?

There is no shortage of anecdotal "information" about what is "safe" or not but we should know how terribly wrong that collective belief can be.

Photo from YachtWorld

Boat is much smaller than I thought with a much smaller flybridge. Where did they put everyone?

No one is guilty of purposely injuring anyone, but of very bad judgement with consequences that will be the worst punishment imaginable. This is heartbreaking and I don’t doubt that there are many on this forum, no matter how expert or experienced that think “but for the Grace of God go I.” Before I get flamed, tell me you haven’t done a dumb thing in a car, boat etc. at some age in your life that could have escalated to tragedy.
Yes, we all have done dumb things, mostly that are no more serious than a turn to starboard without looking back, or taking a racing boat out in seas that are too big (I am still reminded regularly by the stab in my back). Luckily for us, these bad decisions stopped on a short chain.
This group of families had a long chain of events that compounded in tragedy.
I would never go out with 27 people on board at night for a celebration with nutters around, no matter that my 53’ vessel could take it or not, but that is experience. What if this guy (I don’t say Captain) was planning on 12 and had some added people beg for a ride or whatever. Yes, it was incompetent, maybe stupid, but most of all SAD.

Accidents are just that.
Costa Concordia was a crime, not an accident.
You can cover that Silverton with bright yellow stickers from bow to stern and it would not have changed anything. The person capable of making such bad judgements would not read them.
What will come out of this is for the next few years people will recall this tragedy before they load up for a cruise.

since when do we have to look back before turning to starboard ??

we'll know soon enough ... she's been raised ...

Oyster Bay disaster: Kandi Won yacht that drowned 3 children is raised to the surface | Mail Online

Since I realised that there are vessels running behind mine who may not be watching what is happening ahead of them.
Looking behind before turning to stbd or port makes good sense to me!
Maybe you have a rearview mirror?

Let's look at some details. The 1987 34 Silverton pictured here is the same model/style as the one that sunk, which was 1984. The draft is approx. 3.5 feet, shallow but not bad for this vessel. See the scuppers in the transom? That's the cockpit height, well above the waterline. Salon floor is at same level. There's a lot of boat above the waterline. I almost had this boat capsize in a squall, so much that the boat heeled over where the water level was almost to the top of the gunwale, but she did roll back (only 4 persons on board).
The bridge seats 5-6, but you can get 8-9 up top if required.
Second photo shows a nice entry with two strakes and generous chine.
Third photo shows that there is very little keel in the hull. Also the arrow shows the exhaust port which is just above the waterline. With 27 persons on board, the port and starboard exhaust will be underwater as the boat will ride low. Perhaps back pressure created a water leak in the exhaust system?
But let me ask our resident hydro engineer this: a boat that sits low in the water and traveling over shallow depth could actually get pulled down due to hydro forces, can't it? At least the speed will be reduced until the boat crabs into deeper water.
Having 27 persons on board had to be very cramped, with a lot of weight well above the waterline. And the aluminum radar arch on that yacht adds a few pounds.
Just trying to illustrate.

I keep hearing people (often lawyers) saying this boat has a capacity of 10, 12 or 15. I get the feeling that people are thinking that if they say it enough it will be taken as truth. Total BS, most likely being promoted by the involved lawyers and Silverton. We have some very well informed professionals on this forum. Somebody please cite a redily available, authoritative reference that backs up any of these numbers. Somebody is trying desperately to blame the captain or owner (Private insurance is such an easy target) when I believe the blame lies squarely with the industry for failing to publish stability ratings for private yachts. But of course you can't sue the entire industry, nor a manufacturer who adheres to the industry standard.

NYCAP

I don't believe anyone on this thread is blaming anyone - this is a tragedy about which none of us knows all the facts. But personally I don't believe all the stability ratings and placades with lights around them would have prevented those 27 people from boarding that boat, and in using my modest experience, that many people severely overloaded the boat. I respect your right to disagree with that asesssment, but let me give you an opposite example of why I think the human brain is the most important tool for making the final decision.

About 2 years ago I had a dockmate come up to me and say "Beau, would you come over and look at my new inflatable. It was planing fine this AM, but when my wife and I took two guests across the mooring area for dinner, I couldn't get it up on plane at all. I think I must have screwed up the engine" My ego said, of course I'll help and went over to look. Well the tender was certainly rated for a 4 person load according to the placard- but the lightest of the 4 occupants on this little trip had to be 275lbs. But, according to that placard everything was fine, and we all just scratched our heads wondering why that little boat wouldn't plane. Just saying, a lot a folks don't use their noodle enough. Incidently, the boat had the correct horsepower according to the power rating, which was even more befuddling.

seems a little like blame the gun industry when someone gets shot, or sue the drug company when the end user ignores the safety warnings.

Will get the stage sooner or later when a "Government official" will accompany every person who wakes up ion the morning and guide them through the day. Look at that zero unemployment !!!

Actually I lay responsibility/blame with the owner skipper. Looking at the pics, 27 is way over the odds. You don't need a sticker to tell you that. A sticker will tell you if 12 or 14 is the number. Yes he was likely trying to do the right thing by friends and family etc, but if you stuffed people on the floor and boot of your car and had an accident, you would be dead in the water as driver.

Accidents aside, how the hell do you keep track of 27 people on a boat at night?

It was a bad decision and it ended badly. We have all made bad calls and got away with it. This one was on the outer edge of a bad call increasing the risk .

There definitely is a move to blame, both here, in the general public and with the lawyers. This boat WAS overloaded. The results prove that. My point is that nobody, who was in a position to know that, ever told anyone what constitutes an overload in that boat. When an N.A. probably designs a boat and it's manufactured by a professional and experienced company like Silverton, and neither of the professionals are willing to say what is an unsafe load, how is a Sunday sailor or even a captain supposed to make that determination? I've seen boats around this size with probably this many people on board plus ornaments in the Ft. Lauderdale boat parade, but they're not in a position where they'll get hit broadside by a big wake. I don't expect any changes. I think this just needs to be chalked up as tragic accident. Everybody should have done better, but there was nothing unusual done by anyone. In fact I doubt it was the only boat out there that night overloaded, but they didn't flip, so they weren't.