Click for Burger Click for Abeking Click for Westport Click for Glendinning Click for Cross

Air-Electric Drive System

Discussion in 'Technical Discussion' started by TRY, Oct 23, 2006.

Page 7 of 10
  1. TRY, Feb 23, 2008
    #121
    TRY

    TRY Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2004
    Messages:
    269
    Location:
    cannes
    Enough = enough

    Dear Carl,

    Please confirm how to officially unsubscribe as a mamber of this forum.
    I think I don't have to take this crap any longer.
    You have my email, we can keep contact in a private, more civilized, more educated, more polite way!
  2. K1W1, Feb 23, 2008
    #122
    K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2005
    Messages:
    7,433
    Location:
    My Office
    Hi,

    What's the matter?

    I have quoted figures shown on the engine inventors website and figures posted by you yourself.

    You have repeatedly shed away from any technical questions only in the later stages did you write that you were not an engineer.

    Is this for real or only a ruse to escape any scrutiny of your claims to date?

    You did after all try a few weeks ago to get the thread closed when you used: Thanks to all who understood and appreciated.
    Sorry for the others.     in your post.

    I admit I wrote I thought it was a load of Hot Air this is after all the whole principle of this wondrous invention isn't it, heating the air to 900 Degs C seemingly regardless of the quantity or flow rate and reclaiming all that energy that is released after all the work has gone into pressing all that energy into the air receiver.
  3. YachtForums, Feb 23, 2008
    #123
    YachtForums

    YachtForums Administrator

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2002
    Messages:
    20,642
    Location:
    South Florida
    TRY,

    You have used YachtForums as a platform to generate interest in the air-engine concept. This is fine. We are all interested in alternative propulsion. But...

    In disclosing new or unique technologies in an open discussion environment, you must be prepared to answer questions, explain technologies or in some cases, wear a bullet-proof vest. This is the nature of forums... and it is also human nature. There are believers and there are skeptics.

    That said, you have used YachtForums to promote the adaptation of this technology to the yachting industry. What you fail to realize is the level of competence that you are likely to encounter. Case in point, K1W1 has been behind some of the most technologically advanced yachts ever launched. This would have been one of those rare opportunities to directly connect with someone who can influence an industry, but your responses have only raised more questions.

    In the future, I might suggest you take a less "personal" approach in discussions. If you wish to unsubscribe to this thread, then click UserCP on the wood NavBar and go to subscriptions. If you wish to take more extreme measures, then confirm your request and I will remove your membership.
  4. TRY, Mar 22, 2008
    #124
    TRY

    TRY Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2004
    Messages:
    269
    Location:
    cannes
    Many thanks Carl,

    for putting the philosophy on board YF clearly to me.

    For those who are subscribers to The Yacht Report - one of the members' most appreciated magazine according to a poll elsewhere on these forums -
    go to pages 26-27 of current issue #92.
    To my humble knowledge this is the first article about cars in a reputed and reputable yachting magazine.
    The explanations by Tork Buckley are quite straightforward and understandable.

    A Happy Easter to all!
  5. NYCAP123, Mar 22, 2008
    #125
    NYCAP123

    NYCAP123 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2008
    Messages:
    11,210
    Location:
    Long Island, NY
    I am just a dummy compared to you guys so take it from there. I just read this thread. K1W1 you are brilliant and I understand you not wanting your time wasted, but thoughts like TRY's need to be encouraged (even if it may require patience sometimes). Even if way too premature for publication, he's thinking. I figure that, until I'm asked to invest, ideas can only benefit me. I've learned a lot by this thread and I hope it doesn't stop. K1W1 and TRY seem to be butting heads though. I was just wondering if K1W1 thinks this concept should be abandonded completely or is it possible that it could be a seed for something. Maybe if TRY and K1W1 moved off public forum on this together for a bit the combination of TRY's efforts to this point and K1W1's knowledge and critical eye could develope something. We all know new propulsion systems need to be developed. I for one like to watch minds like these work. Thanks.
  6. TRY, Mar 22, 2008
    #126
    TRY

    TRY Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2004
    Messages:
    269
    Location:
    cannes
    Thanks for the moral booster!

    Dearest NYCAP123,
    I sincerely appreciate your opinion and your view on this development.
    You seem to understand that only so much can be detailed as long as the industrial process is not entirely established.
    I tried to inform this community of the technical achievements and novel performance, without being able or willing to reveil all tricks of genius needed and implemented to make this engine work.
    And work it does, we're now in some 45 countries spread over the globe, we're in the Automotive X-prize, we're in the New York Motor Show.
    I'm trying to promote the yachting applications via propulsion and power generation, which is not easy in an upcoming company where the obvious potential revenue comes from automotive and static applications, rather than the infinimous boat and pleasure-craft applications - YET!
    So therefore, again, my sincere thanks NYCAP123!:) :) :)
  7. The Reverend, Mar 22, 2008
    #127
    The Reverend

    The Reverend New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2007
    Messages:
    55
    Location:
    La Paz Mexico
    Moral Spoiler

    I have followed the development of this car on and off for a few years now.
    The BBC has regularly covered the story.
    Every time there is a report on the car the reporters are never allowed to actually drive or demo the car with the claimed speed/performance characteristics
    The next development is always 'just about to happen' this me reminds of the Australian Split Cycle engine operation of the 90's.

    Despite whatever is being claimed about these developments the numbers do not add up. This car is actually behind many cars already on the road as far as claiming the X-prize is concerned!

    The same story nearly eight years ago:-
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/988265.stm

    http://www.splitcycle.com.au/failure.html
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2008
  8. MaxResolution, Mar 22, 2008
    #128
    MaxResolution

    MaxResolution Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2007
    Messages:
    159
    Location:
    Little Rock
    Try-dyed!

    Try, -I agree with Carl's points. It would be nice if you actually cared about watercraft. Nonetheless, --I too-- have little choice but to extoll my dreams, abstractly, as I am without a machine shop and living roughly 1000 miles from any relevant body of water to boot... But, what I figured out is this; IF it is possible to create a self-powered boat, (and I clearly mean really Huge ones,) it must be possible to construct one in minature, such that I could experiment and prove these points (specifically about steam and pressure-differentials,) in my swimming pool.

    What you are pushing is like a TAX to pay for Global Warming. Go tell this to Al Gore. What you gain in eco-benefits is not worth jack to these diesel fans. What you have discussed is utterly irrelevant to the yachting community. It's a battery-operated, bayside cruisemobile. Great for a small community rental program, up to pushing a Canoe, or better yet, a Kyiak, up to about 22-knots, for maybe 6hrs of local use tops, beyond which it's LESS practicle than Hughs' Spruce Goose.

    I still believe a boat weighing 20 Tons should be able to generate around 40-100KW of steam power while idling in place. Probably not enough to propell it against the drag, but it also depends on-how-you use the STEAM, (or in your case, the hot air!)
  9. Marmot, Mar 22, 2008
    #129
    Marmot

    Marmot Senior Member

    Joined:
    May 20, 2007
    Messages:
    3,300
    Location:
    9114 S. Central Ave
    "I still believe a boat weighing 20 Tons should be able to generate around 40-100KW of steam power while idling in place."

    I would love to hear more about this, please explain.
  10. MaxResolution, Mar 22, 2008
    #130
    MaxResolution

    MaxResolution Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2007
    Messages:
    159
    Location:
    Little Rock
    Air/Water differentials

    I envision a process that should work by combining two simple, but antiquated patents. One of which is not that 'old', but they both depend on 'rarefaction' of water, which is what is responsible for the icy cool blue color of the water around the equator. (The only other places this occurs are considerably above sea-level.) I am talking about harnessing wildly discernable differentials in air & adjacent water pressures. The patent for making the steam is held by a deceassed man named Schaffer, who misinterpreted the ideal purpose of his invention. First, he did not consider the opportunity to supply a constant input velocity, nor did he make any sound use of the massive spinning turbine aparatus. hummm? ..So I see this as ideal for "propulsion" instead of virtually free household heating!

    BTW, I knew Robert Fulton III, and I also studied filmmaking under his son. Neither would agree with the notion of sharing ideas about unpatented products. IMHO, mankind cannot sustain the qualities of life as we've grown used to without a rapid about-face on energy usage in application. Plus, you definately might get snuffed if you threaten the European Oilgarchy.
  11. Marmot, Mar 22, 2008
    #131
    Marmot

    Marmot Senior Member

    Joined:
    May 20, 2007
    Messages:
    3,300
    Location:
    9114 S. Central Ave
    Hmmmmm, yes, I thought it might be something along those lines.
  12. TRY, Apr 4, 2008
    #132
    TRY

    TRY Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2004
    Messages:
    269
    Location:
    cannes
    Specifically yachting!

    12kva genset - 65 kgs - 3600 Euro.
    This includes soundshield, but not the exhaust because we don't need one!
  13. TSI AV, Apr 4, 2008
    #133
    TSI AV

    TSI AV Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2006
    Messages:
    104
    Location:
    Estonia
    Hi,

    Good news, TRY.

    Further to this topic, there is a nice article in THE YACHTREPORT magazine about this concept and the TATA car.

    There are even pictures posted. The car looks great !

    regards,

    Andrei
  14. K1W1, Apr 4, 2008
    #134
    K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2005
    Messages:
    7,433
    Location:
    My Office
    Does this include the Air Receivers and such like?
  15. TRY, Apr 4, 2008
    #135
    TRY

    TRY Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2004
    Messages:
    269
    Location:
    cannes
    See, now I have a problem

    Dear K1W1,

    What do you call "air receivers and such like"?
    If air "receivers" mean the tanks (300 bar pressure vessels), the answer is no.
    We don't know how big you would like the tanks.
    Basically 100L at 300 bar = 10kw for 1 hour, approx.
    Is this a co-production use or emergency?

    When weight is important we use carbon-fiber filament-wound tanks.
    If weight is not important you can use steel, cheaper but heavier.

    "Such like" I really don't know, please specify.
  16. TSI AV, Apr 4, 2008
    #136
    TSI AV

    TSI AV Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2006
    Messages:
    104
    Location:
    Estonia
    TRY,

    Is this car available (or will be) in Europe soon ?

    Please advise appx price if possible.

    rgds,

    Andrei
  17. TRY, Apr 4, 2008
    #137
    TRY

    TRY Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2004
    Messages:
    269
    Location:
    cannes
    Availability

    According to licences signed, the green car (Automotive X-prize entry) will be available in 2009 at approx 6.5-7K euro.
    So far no agreements have been signed in your area.
  18. The Reverend, Apr 4, 2008
    #138
    The Reverend

    The Reverend New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2007
    Messages:
    55
    Location:
    La Paz Mexico
  19. TRY, Apr 5, 2008
    #139
    TRY

    TRY Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2004
    Messages:
    269
    Location:
    cannes
    Green monster is called OneCat

    Was not designed nor engineered to be pretty or stylish, but to be efficient, clean, cheap to run.
    Then, style and design are always a very personal opinion.
    Mexico was our first licence-country.

    I was asked to stick to yachting, car messages from now on as private therefore, thanks.
  20. K1W1, Apr 5, 2008
    #140
    K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2005
    Messages:
    7,433
    Location:
    My Office
    Hi,

    Yes I meant tanks.

    If it the engine develops 10 kW for an hour on 100L of air at 300 Bar how much of the 10 kW developed will be needed to recompress the air to keep the engine running?

    Another thought worth considering is 10 kW is only useful for a very small boat it would need given your figures 2.4 Cu M of air compressed at 300 Bar to run for 24 Hrs- that is a lot of space on a small boat.
Page 7 of 10