Air-Electric Drive System

Try, Are you going to give us some proper details this time or are you going to keep drip feeding us with tidbits of irrelevant info? I assume that most people that read this forum are either techie types or are interested in tech stuff and therefore would rather discuss the technical merits of you latest idea rather than be drawn into your latest ‘promoter investor ‘ scheme

Has anyone asked about the size and weight of the 300 BAR pressure vessels. As a comparison, batteries for electric boats are considered the drawback because of the weight of the batteries. However, with the system being discussed here, my understanding is that installed on a boat, a mains electrical powered air compressor is used to pack away an enormous quantity of air, which is then released through the compressor to drive the electric motor that now acts as a generator to produce electricity to power electric engines to propel a boat. The weight and size of the 300 BAR pressure vessels must be really really huge in order to provide decent range.

Then there is the racket whilst the compressor is filling the air tanks and doesn't the air become heated whilst being compressed? Shouldn't it be cooled before being stored in the pressure vessels?

These compressed air accumulators, for that is what they are, bring to mind fireless steam locomotives http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fireless_locomotive and hydraulic accumulators http://www.subbrit.org.uk/sb-sites/sites/h/hydraulic_power_in_london/index.shtml

I could be getting this all wrong, but it seems a cumbersome method of propelling a boat or a car. Why not cut out the electric motors and use the compressed air to drive the props directly with small turbines.

In fact, injecting liquid Hydrogen into the turbine would create a useful and simple jet engine that does not need a compressor bladed inlet and which, produces only steam at the exhaust. Instead of heading for the conventional fuel barge, such a boat would connect up to the shore based compressed air depot, and load up with air and liquid hydrogen, for a spot of boating.

What is the calorific value of liquid hydrogen?

First Pericles

Hi,

I found a CV for Liquid Hydrogen showing a value of 150kJ/g or 48.5 kwh/kg.

I would suggest you take the time to read this whole post. It seems that the original poster is just intent on blowing hs own trumpet and is either unable or incapable of answering any really technical questions of which there have been a good number posted.

K1W1

That was the impression I had, having read all 7 pages. There is no such thing as a free lunch. Nigel Calder explained that very well in the current issue of PBO, Hybrid Marine Power Part 2, discussing inefficiencies in Diesel Electrics.

First Pericles

Hi,

As my Father used to say- First Impressions are lasting impressions.

Welcome to Yacht Forums by the way.

Interesting choice of handle you have there- What's behind it Shakespeare or further back in the annals of time?

K1W1,

Thanks for the welcome. It's just a play on the name my grandmother gave me. My parents decided on Clive Martin, but my grandmother decided she preferred Perry and it stuck. On other marine forums, I post as Pericles, but Carl pointed out that on YF, Pericles is in Atlanta. As I'm older than he is, First Pericles suggested itself.

Pericles of Athens founded the Athenian navy and was a bit of a lad with Aspasia of Miletus. What can I say? A admirable role model. BTW, are you an NZer? I grew up in Wellington 1949-53. Family went out on Shaw Savil Tamaroa and returned on P & O Strathaird, a steam turbine electric! http://www.ozhoo.net.au/~strathsisters/strathaird/index.htm

Regards,

First Pericles

I'm not conservative like these desk jockeys... I get your idea and seems India TATA group also gets it. I have a hydrofoil assisted catamaran I have designed and have/am building. I've looked at diesel electric hybrids and think there lots of short falls. I think this air motor is a fantastic idea and would like be part of the break through. How can I help... I don't have 3 smoke stacks coming out of my shop, but I can build a really attractive, light, fast, effiecent, catamaran, very cheap.

As someone that is neither a conservative or a desk jockey (all though as my career progresses I'm starting to become one!)
I don't get it!
How can compressed air be anything but a (poor) method of storing energy?
For example many yachts and ships use compressed air to start their engines using similar principles , this air is stored at high pressure in very heavy large vessels this energy is only able to turn the engines over for a minute or so (there are regs on the number of starts they should be capable of).
Meanwhile the main fuel in liquid form is easily stored in thin walled tanks and the equivalent volume is able to power the vessel for many hours.
Please explain.

Hi,

Why do you want it closed there Try? Is this wondrous technology not as wondrous as you are trying to make everyone believe?

I seem to recall reading earlier on here how you were going to amaze and thrill all the non believers with this incredible technology that seemed too good to be true.

I also noticed a while back that you ignored any half technical questions that were posted about your claims.

The question posted by YF Member The Reverend is a valid one as were some that he posted earlier that were unanswered.

I don't think closing the tread is an applicable solution. The subject was brought up and lots of discussions have occured. You can't just wipe that past out, or rewrite it.

You might suggest to the new new poster that he go back over the material more throughly, and then bring up his doubts after that.

The Discovery Channel recently aired a show called "Future Cars" that examined several emerging technologies including, hybrids, fuel cells, solar and... an "air" engine developed in France. They interviewed the inventor. I only caught the last couple of minutes, but they have a working, proof of concept prototype.

I don't think it would be appropriate to close this thread, but hopefully we understand the ramifications of making announcements without having the data available to substantiate claims.

This just came across my desk, India's largest auto manufacturer, Tata Motors, is going into production with an air-powered car using a (you guessed it!) French-developed air-engine... and it's coming stateside.

Popular Mechanics article...
http://www.popularmechanics.com/automotive/new_cars/4251491.html?series=19

The U.S. Venture: Zero Pollution Motors (ZPM)...
http://zeropollutionmotors.us/?page_id=45

The Air-Engine Company: Motor Development International (MDI)...
http://www.mdi.lu/eng/affiche_eng.php?page=accueil

Hi,

Carl- Are you signed up to buy one yet?

You might view this Tata Motor announcement with some scepticism. I believe this same Indian company announced the same about the Revetec engine. They appear ready to grasp and develop any new tech that might possible fullfill both their low price mass market and that of China. Whether it comes to fruition is another question??

Of course never underestimate the inventiveness of the India culture.

...cross reference

http://www.yachtforums.com/forums/technical-discussion/417-revolutionary-engine-debuts-miami-show-2.html?

Hi,

TRY- It seems like you are intent on blowing your own trumpet all the way here.

I treat your latest statement as I have treated most of what you have written as being just a load of hot air!

If as you and the website authors will have us believe this engine can produce it's power through a bit of jiggery pokey and only use .8 Lt of fuel per hour of any fuel.

How do you compensate for the difference in calorific values between the different fuels on the market?

Will the trunk of the car be able to hold enough Coal/Wood/HFO to complete a 1000 mile journey?

You might do well to read the website yourself. There are claims there that the cars will develop 75 hp and do 96 mph with a economy of 100 mpg.Given your often repeated statement about consumption the math just doesn't add up and it isn't the only thing.

96 ( The quoted speed) divided by .8( the supposed consumption per hour)= 120 x 3.786 ( A US Gal in Litres) = 454.32 mpg ( the supposed economy of this vehicle worked out mathematically with the figures published online)

Quite a difference already, I can't wait to see the reality if it ever gets that far.

TATA have been down this road before as stated above, I will refrain from comment on the US Investment options at this point as I am still waiting to get an answer to my carefully worded application.