Opinions about Lincoln 430 cid engines for marine use???

Glory Days

Well, they are torquey.
And smooth running (Lincoln once wanted to build the American Rolls Royce).
Had one in my '61 Continental once (see photo).
Parts continue to remain available (especially from antique Lincoln parts suppliers) - but are becoming increasingly expensive (ask any 427 motor owner what's that like).
They do not run up as high as 454s or 440s in terms of rpms. You have to get your thrust from the bigger props 430s can twist.
Frankly, unless it's a totally original classic you want - try something more modern.
Cheers!
Eric

If the engines are operational I would stick with the 430's. Rebuilt prices on a 430 is less than a 454. If you have to go modern than go to a 460 (bolt in) and this is a extremley common engine with great parts availability.

Performance wise the 430 ran from 350 to 380hp (BHP) and was built oversquare bore=4.25, stroke=3.7 so they can get rpms if they dont have to run threw a restrictive exhaust system like a lincoln. The horse power on these is comparable to the 454/440's since most marine engines were the truck version and not the LT/magnum motors.

Lincolns are fine



Hi guys,

I think the big Lincolns are great, and often maligned. They don't produce the ultimate top end power of a 427, and them may use more or less fuel, I don't know, but they are built of old-world iron, and lots of it. They're very tough motors. In the end, who really uses their motors at WOT anyway, the torque of a MEL is fine for cruising. Many times all they need is a Pertronix conversion, and a good tune up.

I interviewed a guy who worked at the CC engine plant a few years back, and he said they were as good as any engine cc offered, as far as doing the job and avoiding customer callbacks.

I would post directly here, but wish to reference you to a link with a ton of info about the Lincoln, much of which has oddly enough, come from Germany. If my buddy Theo can find parts in Germany, we can find them here!
http://www.network54.com/Forum/503931/thread/1149538038/last-1149538038

Lincoln fans enjoy!

Regards, Paul

"dogsharks"

opinions on 430 lincolns

I think Eric has hit it on the head.
The first Commander I looked at 1964-38' had 430's as original equip. When I asked the owner why he re-powered her at 2000 hours he said it was not because they weren't powerful enough, but the local NAPA store in every town he berthed in on the Great Lakes had Parts for the crusader 454's and when he had last looked for parts for the 430's some of the younger clerks just stared at him.

To him it was a consideration of not only were parts available but how long did he have to wait for them and how hard were they to find. So if you spend much of your boating time berthed and have no real plans to keep a schedule while in the midst of a cruise this is not an issue for you I would think.
Check out Lawrence Neislers posts on the Commander Club site to hear why he is changing out the 430's to the new FI crusader 8.2.

Also be aware I am not a purist as I changed out 427's for 2 cat 3126 420hp engines in an attempt to get more economy and a few trips without engine problems. I have been sucessful at both!
Mark

The parts supply issue is very real, indeed.

I've been running my 427s for ten years now, and quickly learned NOT to go into the local autoparts store and ask for 427 Ford parts. One guy smugly one day said "you must mean the Chevy 427, because Ford never built a 427". When I heard that, I learned exactly what I needed to know, and thanked him, turned around and walked out.

The 427 Ford is not a rare motor by many standards. If you're working on a dual plug Aston Martin, then yes, you have something to whine about, but not on a Ford 427. The Lincoln is not far behind. I dare say, they may actually have made more Lincoln motors than 427 motors, with all the automobile production that relied on that series of motor, but yes, the "marine" parts are going to take some time.

My advice to anyone who elects to run the older motors, will be to get your consumable parts in advance, impellers, gaskets, whatever, and just keep them where you can get them. Most of the actual automotive parts are readily accessible.

When it comes to repowering a 430 installation, I've seen it happen. The owner has old motors, the owner doesn't have a clue without assistance on how to fix anything, the motors are missing a bit, the owner gets nervous because an ancillary part is $400 or so, and starts thinking about repowering, and eventually convinces himself it's better to spend $30 to $40K on new motors when in reality, a Pertronix ignition upgrade, new coils and wires, proper valve settings, retiming, and a carb rebuild are all that's required for ten more years of service. In this lifetime "because I want to" is sometimes a valid reason to do anything, and I suspect it's the reason for a diesel repower, as it is highly doubtful it can be economically justified.

For those able to "do it themselves" without having to rely on someone else for everything, the tune up part would be an afternoon, and the carb rebuild would be an evening or two. Quite honestly, a pair of rebuilt 430s would probably wear out the owner long before they wore out, heavy iron, good basic design.

On my own 427s I (also) thought I would be repowering when I bought the boat. They looked pretty bad, however "looks" is not the measure of internal condition. After spending some TLC time with each engine, I discovered one cylinder had no compression at all. None. The boat ran almost well enough on 7 cylinders, it was hard to tell one was not firing. It was an improperly adjusted valve. After a proper setting of the valve clearance, the compression came up to normal, and I've run those motors ten years and they start and perform almost like new.

Therefore, I think people are way too quick to repower. Service yards are quick to say they need to, friends don't mind seeing someone else spend the bucks, and in the end the new motors will probably work fine and the value of the boat will be higher. Did some of those guys really NEED to repower, heck no, maybe they wanted to, and like I said, "becuase I want to" may well be a
valid reason for someone to spend their hard earned cash.

As far as being a basic solid design, the 430 is fine. The ancillary equipment wears out just like it does on all other motors. Worn ancillary equipment is NO reason for a repowering. Not being able to get marine 430 parts at your local hot rod shop is NO reason for repowering. If I have a friend in Germany rebuilding one with little difficulty in finding parts, anyone with the desire, information, and cash can (and will) find parts here in the US.

As an iteresting sidenote, I have a buddy who wrote some really nice boating articles, who also collected Lincolns. He said the original 430 series was offered with 375 hp, with options up to 400 with the three-carb setup. They never were high rpm race cars, but they would propell a 6000 pound land yacht with authority. He said they had to lower the power ratings due to the fact that they were so powerful at 375, they were torquing the body so the doors wouldn't close!

I wanted to give the 430 Lincoln guys a boost, especially since I interviewed a CC engine plant guy a few years ago, and he was adament, that "the 430 was as good as any other engine CC used, regarding performance and call-back from customers". At the time I was trolling for some sort of a flaw, perhaps, but as I searched longer, all I got about the Lincoln was it was heavy, durable, and produced lots of torque.

Regards, P

"dogsharks"

So many boats, so little time.

Good choice it would it would take thousand's of hours to even put a dent in the cost of repowering. For those of you are eco freindly like me it takes a lot of emissions to produce new equipment for a repower.