Help in choosing the right size Carver

Hello timbuk2, Welcome to YachtForums. A $500K budget provides many opportunities in the used yacht marketplace. I'm curious as to why you have already decided on Carver as your target marque. As far as size of boat: In an industry that charges for most everything "by the foot" (haulouts, dockage, washing/waxing) it makes sense to try to buy the most accommodation, utility and cruising/liveaboard comfort in the smallest platform. What the Carver will do for you is that it's a mainstream yacht will likely be easy to re-sell if you ultimately decide it's not the right choice.

Find the largest, best handling, boat you can get (for your plans), within your budget, I can’t be of any advice on that, but many highly experienced YF members can.

But what I know, size will matter after a while, so bigger is better if you have the choice!!

Good luck and keep us posted!

So, a few questions so we can advise you better. How does your wife feel about the plan? What is your experience and hers? If you lack experience, do you have a plan for getting trained? How much time have you spent in Florida and what areas have you found you like and dislike as far as places to spend extensive time aboard? How important are things like galley size and do you prefer it up or down? How tall are you and is head room an issue? Will you be fishing or just cruising? Prefer marinas or anchorages?

Charter. I always recommend chartering different sizes to get a feel for what you like and don't.

There are a lot of Carver owners around here to discuss the boats themselves. I'm just trying to make sure you're not jumping into selecting a boat prematurely. When I think of boats to cruise the Caribbean Carver isn't the first boat that comes to mind. However, when I think of good space utilization it does quickly come to mind. How are your mechanical skills and will you do most of the work itself or have shipyards do it? You mentioned boat purchase price and that's only half the financial issue. What have you anticipated or budgeted for annual costs, operating, maintenance and docking?

If you haven't figured it all out by the time you retire, nothing wrong with that. Coming to Florida, looking at boats, perhaps even living temporarily in a couple of different areas can be enjoyable and very helpful. I'm very pro-Fort Lauderdale, but it's not for everyone. Many retirees prefer southwest Florida and there are some wonderful towns there, quieter than Miami, Fort Lauderdale and West Palm and dockage is less expensive. It also is different a little further north on the east coast. Then a lot of retirees love being places like Marathon.

Back to your questions about size. Dockage between the smallest and largest you mention could run $400-500 difference in a year. Maintenance will vary a little. Fuel usage is going to depend on the engines. At displacement speed it won't vary much but at other speeds might. Things like hauling and washing will vary.

More of an issue will be what the two of you can comfortably handle. One group of people will argue to get the smallest that will accommodate your needs while another will say get the largest that fits within your budget. It's really a balancing act. All three are within ranges of owner operator sizes, depending on experience. In many ways they'll handle much the same. Draft and air draft figure into your considerations. There is 14" difference from the smallest to largest you're talking about but all three have rather shallow drafts.

When you do get ready to buy, make sure you get a boat survey, an engine survey and a good sea trial.

When buyers are trying to decide between two boats I almost always recommend going for the large one, because they'll be there in the next couple of years anyway. That way you avoid the second broker's fee. This is NOT my recommendation for you.
1) You're retiring and looking for a live aboard. That tells me that you won't be moving up any time soon.
2) You intend to travel. The bigger the boat, the harder it is to find slips.
3) The 57 is more boat to care for and crew. I've noticed that the 57 seems a bit cumbersome in close quarters.
4) Retired and have a budget tells me that you don't want to waste money. All costs go up by the foot.

So my apologies to the Mrs., but bigger isn't always better. lol More boat than you need can be as bad as less boat than you need. The best boat is the one that suits your circumstance.

I'm not very familiar with those particular models, and we don't usually shop by boat brand... but FWIW when we are shopping, one of our key criteria is good access to side decks and cleats, sufficient cleats and in useful positions, etc.

Ideally, I look for deck layouts that I can (usually) dock by myself (i.e., without crew).. and then secondarily, for layouts that will be easy for our deck crew (usually wifey, sometimes me) to manage. There are other features we look for as well, of course, but this one usually is a show-stopper; of the deck layout won't work for us, it doesn't matter how nice the rest of the boat is.

-Chris

I have been boating for 50 years, although only big boating for a year. There is one thing I can tell you with certainty. I have never heard the term "I wish my boat was smaller" ever uttered by a boat owner. Mine is a scant 36' but so far, it has been just right. The bigger boats are made for a reason, because they sell!

I have a 450 voyager and love it. We have your plans exactly. We bought the 450 with the intention on living aboard. We have had it 2 years and love it. It is a 2 stateroom pilot house model. I've seen the 3 stateroom 460 and don't like it. Everything looses fo that third stateroom. Also you loose the indoor helm, or at least on the model we saw. We use the indoor a lot. Much better to pilot indoor in bad weather instead of outdoor. If you really need the 3 rd stateroom go with the 52. Our budget was a bit more constrained than yours so the 450 was right to pay cash and have enough left to live comfortably. My main suggestion is buy a freshwater boat. I bought a 6 year old saltwater boat before and it was horrible compared to our 15 year old fresh. We bought our present one in northern Illinois and brought it to ky. It was not only in fresh water but in a barn for 6 months a year. Still looks new. We will bring it to Florida next year but I will keep on top of it to keep it nice. We will bring it back up the rivers in summer to avoid hurricanes and salt. Bottom line, freshwater, and the 52. We love our 450 but we will not have more that 2 guests at a time. If we do it has a pullout couch in the salon that will do for a few nights.

Timbuk 2. Sounds like you and your wife are very well prepared for your new life. You'll have a blast. If I was going to live on the boat as you are, I'd tend toward the largest one I could manage. I just want to toss out the fact there are some other brands to consider. The first that comes to my mind is Hatteras and you'll find many 50-70' models available. I'm talking the MY's only for your type living. But most have good layouts, are spacious and are solid rough water boats.

Then there are Grand Banks. To get a feel on them there are many available for charter. The old Pacific Mariner 65 (Ok, I admit a strong prejudice toward the manufacturer of it but it has a great layout). There are even some brands that you'd never think of as live aboards or retirement boats that may surprise you. Sunseeker Manhattans and MY's in that range will surprise you.

Now, if economy is more important to you that speed, then traditional trawlers come into play but based on your Carver thoughts I wouldn't think you'd want them.

I like Carvers fine. Just wouldn't narrow it down until I'd considered and looked at lots of boats. I'd recommend going to yachtworld and just doing searches there to get an idea of boats that might fit your need. Many of these might match the Carver in layout, some might top them, but also some might be better offshore boats. I imagine you crossing to the Bahamas frequently. Beautiful conditions for that today as we just came up the coast. But often times you encounter decent conditions close to shore and then rougher across the gulf stream. On the other hand, there are tons of Carvers in Texas and on the Great Lakes and they get rough at times too.

I wanted to focus on his preference for the 2 vs. 3 staterooms. Depending on what size you get, while more staterooms sound nice, most of the time it's going to just be the two of you. So, I'd really focus on living space and the master stateroom and then others secondarily. I'd plan for the number of people that I'd have 98% of the time. The other 2% you can figure out a short term solution.

If you buy a fresh water boat you may be buying it somewhere that you can take it by water from there to Florida. A great start or maybe several vacations. As to the fresh water vs salt, there are a lot of very well maintained boats kept in salt water. The key is condition and how it does on a survey. Now for an I/O with outdrives it is a different story. But hulls blister in fresh water too. Corrosion occurs in fresh and salt. Yes, I'd still an ideal fresh water boat, well maintained, kept under cover, can be a great find. But you're going to be using in salt water. One thing to recognize too if looking at fresh water is that you may need to change the anodes.

Buy American (Cummins) and look for the right models, parts are more easy to get, and most of the time cheaper, even the Euro is now almost equal value!

You might want to give some thought -- together -- to the idea of using your house for a fishing trip. Folks do it all the time, of course, so I'm not meaning discouragement... only that you'll have to be sure all the "stuff" inside is bolted down and ready for whatever sea states you stumble into. Which means either a potentially significant period of preparation, stowing away all your day-to-day paraphernalia, or maybe it means you have a place for everything and always always always put stuff in its place immediately after use. Think about table lamps, just as one example (but there are fixes for stuff like that, too.)

Sure, folks have preferences, but most every maker produces good, at least decent, if nothing else acceptable, engines. Maybe OK to just find the boat(s) you like, then worry about engines later. That model of boat may offer some options, even on the secondary market. And if not, the engines installed could be fine anyway. FWIW, I tend to prefer the engine appropriately matched to the boat's size/weight/purpose and that I can get serviced right here (wherever your here is), right now, with easily available parts that don't cost an arm and a leg... preferably an engine I can service (75-80% of) myself. Lots of options out there will fit that picture.

-Chris

You've got some great advice. Open your mind a little as far as make and model. It's been said many times the right boat finds you.

Living aboard generally means bigger is better, but there are tradeoffs which have been discussed. Costs are greater and you limit your flexibility, especially marina selections.

One other point I don't think has been mentioned, newer is always better especially when it comes to maintenance and reliability. So there are trade offs, newer means smaller but more reliable and bigger means more comfort but older and more work with higher maintenance costs.

With your budget you have a lot of choices. But the best advice anyone can give you is listen closely to your wife.