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Coolant Pump Temp

Discussion in 'Engines' started by RichV, Dec 13, 2023.

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  1. RichV

    RichV Member

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    I have 2 DD 6-71's. The starboard engine runs at 180 deg @1500 rpm and the port engine runs at 181 deg at the same rpm. The starboard fresh water/coolant pump at the same time is 180 deg while the port engine coolant pump is 130 deg. All temps taken with an infrared gun.

    When I first noticed it it was a 40 degree difference. What's going on? I have cleaned the heat exchangers with Barnacle Buster the last 2 seasons. The only thing I can think of is that I changed the coolant (didn't flush), and maybe I didn't bleed all the air out.
  2. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

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    Need to ask a few questions;

    The 180 & 181 temps are from gauges or IR gun?
    6-71 naturals? No Turbo?
    Original DDC or Covington or SS or ST or other marinizer?
    4 or 6 port water manifold from the head to the thermostat?
    Both engines have the same 4 or 6 port water manifold?
    Both engines have the same heat exchanger?
    Both engines have the same engine oil cooler?

    New issue or never measured these temps before?
    MBevins likes this.
  3. RichV

    RichV Member

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    Temp is from gun on the coolant temp sensor. Note; A higher rpm will get a 5 degree difference at the coolant sensor.
    6-71 Turbos - Port turbo was replaced with a remanufactured one about 6 years ago by the previous owner who only ran at idle speeds.
    4 Port water manifold
    Both engines have stainless steel exhaust mixing elbows.

    I assume both engines have the same parts, I'm not on the boat now. I believe they are all original equipment and have not been replaced.
    I never checked the water pump temp before this season, so I assume it's been this way.

    The only other difference on the port engine is that it has always had less sea water coming out of the exhaust port on stern than the starboard. I have changed the impeller several times, and flushed the system with Barnacle Buster twice. That may be related to the temperature difference at the coolant sensor but probably not the coolant pump.

    If the coolant pump sucks in coolant from the heat exchanger and the oil cooler, I probably should compare the temps at those places on each engine.
    I will be back on the boat in a couple weeks.
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2023
  4. DOCKMASTER

    DOCKMASTER Senior Member

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    Is it possible you simply have a bad or failing bearing in that coolant pump? If you had an air lock or restricted raw water flow I would think you would see higher overall engine temp. Curious what made you think to check these temps in the first place given your overall engine temps are spot on?
  5. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

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    With a Turbo, more questions; Wet or dry turbo (water cooled or warped in foil)?
    Inter cooler (air cooler between the turbo and blower)?
    Thermostat on the back of the water manifold facing back or comes up behind and into the H/E?
    Horse power tune if known.
    Original marinizer or original paint color (green, white, beige)?
    Oceans used DDC, Covington and S&S mostly. Others were used on occasion.

    Sorry for the 20 question drill. Lots of many marine packages on the 6-71 block.
    We need to ensure were talking about the same package to be of any help.
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2023
  6. RichV

    RichV Member

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    Change of crew, I'm doing the temperature checks now.
    Wet Turbos
    Intercoolers
    See attached photo for thermostat
    Not sure what horsepower tune is, but the engine is rated 475 hp @2500 rpm
    Not sure what the marinizer is, the heat exchanger?
    Everything is white, but when the previous owner had work done, they repainted some things.

    Attached Files:

  7. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

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    Then 475hp is what the engine is tuned for. This tells us you also have a high out put engine with by-pass blower.

    The 6-71 starts life as a plain industrial long block. Ready for the final bolt on options for use in trucks, pumps, tractors, generators, PTO and boats.
    Including DDC (Detroit Diesel Corp), there were many other different companies that purchased these engines and bolted on their own marine options. They all had their own heat exchangers, oil coolers and lots of different water tubes, hoses, pumps and thermostat housings.

    Sometimes these companies had their own engine paint color, Covington used beige.

    Is that the pan-cake engine? Laid over like an ole slant-6 and not straight up.
    Uses different plumbing, heat exchangers and maybe different thermostat housings, also.

    Have have a fair idea of what you have now. I'll start looking thru my notes. Get back to you with some ideas later.
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2023
  8. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

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    Starting here first;
    Same coolant and mixture (50/50 or 60/40) in use for both engines?

    Is this at idle dockside or underway in gear, making horse power?
    In just a few moments from running to idling down, crawling down into the engine room and shooting the fresh water pump with an IR gun, H E (heat exchanger) water temps can change drastically.
    That pump (fresh/circulating) is drawing water from 2 different paths. The H E and the thermostat bypass.
    On the outside, the pump is near the same from 50 years ago.
    Do you have any notes on your engines past history? Thru the years, there was 4 (or more) ridged impellers in that DDC water pump. Currently 2 different impellers in my notes.
    Any fresh water pump service history? Different impellers here may cause different readings here, between engines.
    Any IR readings from the H E?
  9. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

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    This may, but usually not a good indicator dock side.
    At idle, the beam level of so little can make the out water look greatly different.
    At speed, may be a better indicator.
    If at speed. please tell us more about this.
  10. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

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    Thru the years, we have found many external issues that would contribute to warm engines or real raw water restrictions.
    The butt bitters were;
    Barnacles in the thru hull, before, in & after the sea-cock.
    Also the inlet to the strainer basket.

    Collapsing raw water supply hose. internal Delamination in the raw water supply hose.
    The suction of the raw water pump draws (sucks) the hose in like a paper straw.

    Raw water pump zincs falling into the system restricting raw water flow at or past the pump.

    And my favorite (again last spring on another boat), old zinc chunks restricting the raw dump water after the H E and in the exhaust dump cans (shower heads, exhaust-water mixer, exhaust riser).

    Like checking fuel system issues, a lil vacuum/pressure gauge can be a great tool.
    With adapters, screw one in at the many zinc locations. Make a log of pressure readings at various RPM on both engines.
    Could be interesting results. This can be done dockside.

    Keep us up on your adventures.
  11. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

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    Coolant venting.
    I am sure any trapped air has long ago worked out.

    I assume your coolant recovery system is working fine including fresh 7lb pressure caps (part number 6410879).

    Just in case ya wanna know;
    There are a couple of air trap locations on this monster.
    Those lil hoses in the picture should vent the turbo and back of the exhaust manifold and fixes the big air trap issues.
    The last air trap may be at the thermostat housing.

    Crack this plug to vent the housing.
    bleeder.jpg
  12. RichV

    RichV Member

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    I call it straight up, see picture. I put new coolant in the port engine last year and in the starboard this year. I used Walmart Super Tech prediluted 50/50 Heavy-Duty Extended Life Antifreeze/Coolant. I have wondered if there is air trapped somewhere from the coolant change. You can see from the paint on the screw you mentioned it s still covered in paint. The manual does say to bleed the air after changing the coolant, but I did it at the screw directly to the left of the one you pointed to, closer to the coolant tank.

    The previous mentioned temps were all taken underway at rpms between 1500 and 1850.
    The boat does list to the port a couple inches. There is no way to check the water flow underway because the exhaust tube is under the swim platform.
    The boat does not/never had sea strainers on the engine raw water, just the screens under the hull. I have cleaned the screens on every haul out but never have removed them to inspect. Looking through the screens, they seemed ok. The intake hose doesn't look too old, but I have considered replacing it since I have no record of them ever being replaced.

    I do not have a temp from the gun on heat exchanger. When I go back to the boat in a couple weeks I will get and compare temps on the coolant tank and the pipes going into the FW pump. There is no history of any work done on the FW pumps since 2015 (the only records I have).

    There are (2) zinc locations; Infront of the transmission oil cooler and in front of the heat exchanger. Two weeks ago the trans cooler one was about 1/4 gone and the HE was completely gone. I don't think any pieces would be able to get past the HE.
    I do have a vacuum gauge and adaptors and will give it a try at the dock. I also plan to run it and get new values underway.

    Attached Files:

  13. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

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    The picture in post #6 made it look like a Pan-Cake install.
    DDC did this to lower the install height for some customers.

    You have the Real Macoy, DDC 485 HP, 6-71 TIB.
    Sweet.

    Should also be 2 plugs on your raw water pump that may use zincs.

    You pulled this screw??
    bolt.jpg
  14. cleanslate

    cleanslate Senior Member

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    It's a J and T 671. Same as my 471s low profile J and T engines. White paint is usually J and T , Covington would be silver . A least when it comes to Ocean.
  15. cleanslate

    cleanslate Senior Member

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    You said it, your problem is lack of water coming out port engine. Haul your boat. Start from the port engine intake, remove the sea strainer screen and move forward from there for any water restrictions. Hoses, heat exchanger, coolers, pump, exhaust elbow and mixing elbow ports..all of it needs to be removed , inspected and cleaned. You could just have a load of sea stuff between the intake screen and thru hull fitting. Any way. Just need to start from point A to B ,and you will find your problem. If all clear, then your water pump could be getting ''tired''.
  16. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

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    485 HP tune was DDC.

    Attached Files:

  17. cleanslate

    cleanslate Senior Member

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    If you call Johnson and Towers Mt. Laurel NJ, ask for Jeff in the parts dept. , and nicely ask him for the engine start up and test reports for your engines. He will need your model/unit numbers and serial numbers for each engine. Assuming you have J and T engines, which I think you do. Also helps to buy some parts from him , to encourage him to search the paper archive file for you. I have my reports from them going back to 1980 start up at Ocean. It's a wealth of information.
  18. cleanslate

    cleanslate Senior Member

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    Hmm, I like that '' Pleasure Craft'' Think I'll rename my boat. You should consider it too, CR. How about '' The Pleasure Craft'' ?
  19. cleanslate

    cleanslate Senior Member

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    Hard to really see what's going on with out removing the screens. You need to get them off, look up into the thru-hull for restrictions. Wire wheel the screen, both sides, get all the holes open. Then lightly paint them with bottom paint or what ever you like . Don't fill in the holes with to much paint. Barnacles and muscles like to grow under the screens.
  20. RichV

    RichV Member

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    Yep, that's my engine.

    That's the screw on the starboard engine that I bled. The port engine has a drain cock there.