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Anyone in Ft. Lauderdale recommend a good Lawyer

Discussion in 'General Yachting Discussion' started by scott49, Feb 1, 2009.

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  1. scott49

    scott49 Senior Member

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    As I am up in Seattle My yacht was damaged by a shipyard in Ft. Lauderdale. I have met with the yard foremen and also the manager of the shipyard with no help. They both said they were sorry and admitted to the damage. Talked with the ship yard owner once and all He did is yell at me and be littled me. I moved my yacht out and now have called and left him four messages to work this out and He never calls me back. I hate to use lawyers but I also don't like having my yacht damaged and being yelled at. When I hire a lawyer and if he gives me the OK and if Carl @ YF gives the OK I will let you ALL know what ship yard it is. Please PM me with your recommendations.
  2. stevenpet

    stevenpet New Member

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    My 2 cents--for what its worth

    It always sucks to have to resort to lawyers, but when they won't even communicate with you and make absolutely no effort to resolve the problem, then it sound like its time.

    I would first start by calling the Florida Bar Association. Then I would check the public records for an attorney who’s sued them before, particularly if he won. He (she) would already be familiar with the management and their personality and strategize accordingly. You may even ask your attorney in Seattle to recommend someone. I would talk to several different firms before I decided on one and before I filed anything in court, I would try to resolve the issue between attorneys, being very specific about what you expect them to do and why it it not unreasonable. This strategy has always worked well for me since I can collect so much information to assure that I win.

    [I hope I'm not going too far out on a limb and sounding patronizing with my advice below. I don't mean to offend and I hope it helps. Besides, this is the advice I wish I would have recieved several years ago with a dishonest business partner.]

    A word of advice, forget about the personal insult because it will only cloud your judgment and taint the issue even more. Maintain your dignity and don't play the fool. If you always remain cool headed, assertive and direct, especially when they have not, then it will greatly increase your chances of success. Besides, attorneys or judges couldn’t care less about your bruised ego since it only gets in the way and they’re not your mother.

    Also, don’t let this damage your quality of life, your reputation or your health.

    Good luck.
  3. NYCAP123

    NYCAP123 Senior Member

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    RU able to ascertain who their insurance carrier is. Depending on the size of the claim you may want to go directly through them or through small claims. Remember the lawyers will take expenses and a cut as will any collection agencies involved, assuming that you win and can collect. Then there is your time and expense coming to court and digging up assets. (A judgement and a metro card will get you on a subway if you get my drift.) If it's only a pound of flesh you're seeking you may just want to take solace in pulling your business and letting others know you've had a bad experience with them. That's lost business and will hurt more than a few thousand from a suit. Of course be very careful about making any claims that you not only can but are willing to back up. Sometimes it's good enough just to warn your friends that they may want to go elsewhere. Stevenpet's last piece of advice also bears repeating: "forget about the personal insult because it will only cloud your judgment and taint the issue even more. Maintain your dignity and don't play the fool. If you always remain cool headed, assertive and direct, especially when they have not, then it will greatly increase your chances of success. Besides, attorneys or judges couldn't’t care less about your bruised ego since it only gets in the way and they’re not your mother.
    Also, don’t let this damage your quality of life, your reputation or your health".
    Getting a rec from your local attorney is a very good way to go. Even if he just checks with the FBA or the ABA he may very well get a better rec and can check into them a bit further.
    Finally, establishing proper communication is key. A couple of years ago I was owed a few hundred dollars. The company went silent. After judgement the amount was doubled. Still silence. As I prepared to go for their business license and assets I heard that the person I had dealt with left the company under bad circumstances so I dropped a note to the company president and promptly got a check. From 20 years in the collection business I can tell you that specific threats are unproductive ('I will sue you'), and suits should be a last resort. Only the lawyers really win there.
  4. ychtcptn

    ychtcptn Senior Member

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    Rob Maas
  5. NYCAP123

    NYCAP123 Senior Member

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    Rob Maas has excellent creds, but I doubt you'd want him (although possibly a rec from him). You see, a good lawyer is not always the best way to go. You certainly want a lawyer who knows the law, but he has to be a good fit for the case. If you get a top lawyer for a piddly case he'll farm it out to a first year associate or put in on the bottom of his stack. If you get a great litigator who's a bad negotiator you end up in a 10 year protracted court battle and come away with nothing where a negotiator might settle it with 3 phone calls. I once did that very thing on a case referred to me by a high priced Manhattan lawyer who had it in his files for 3 years and reduced it to judgement. And for those 3 phone calls I took 50% of the recovery. (easiest money I ever made.) The lawyer then took his cut and expenses. The client? He just got more frustration heaped on top.
  6. JWY

    JWY Senior Member

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    Rob Maas is an excellent recommendation. I have recommended Rob in the past but almost exclusively recommend Michael Moore & Assoc. and have for years. When clients are being serviced by one of the less senior staff, Michael has always been eager to oversee or jump in.

    No connections, just numerous satisfied clients.

    Moore & Company
    Coral Gables, FL
    (786) 221-0600 Office
    www.moore-and-co.net
  7. stevenpet

    stevenpet New Member

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    Honestly, the best way I've found to get the attention of a company that is completely ignoring me is to publicly demonstrate in front of their office. In America, the right to peacefully protest is more of a fundamental right than the right to bear arms.

    I did this to Qwest Telecommunications a few years ago when they botched the phone transfers when I moved my company to a new location. We had planned for 6 months for a smooth transition and instead of the phones being out for 1 day, they were out for almost 3 WEEKS! Then to add insult to injury, they grossly overcharged us.

    Of course it was impossible to get any help by trying to talk to them, so we called the police station to tell them what we would be doing, (which was on the next corner) we made a half dozen signs and had them begging to help us within the hour. Their office building was over 15 stories high and when we looked up all we could see was a wall of faces. I was amazed at how different their attitude was that day.

    One of our signs read, "Honk if you're being haunted by Qwests Spirit of Service." Sadly, even city busses and police cars were honking as they passed and dozens of their employees whispered their approved as they walked by.

    They removed all the phone transfer charges and even paid our phone bill for a few months. Sadly, it didn't even come close to our lost revenue. Also, I ended up with the number of a higher up manager who always expedited every problem we had since then.

    Half my friends are attorneys and for years I got calls from their clients for advice on how to do the same thing. Even several of my employees decided to be proactive and stop being the victim and used this technique very effectively with both small and big business.

    (There are some right ways and wrong ways to do this, so get some advice before just showing up with a bull horn and large sign.)
  8. K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

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    Hi,

    I would also agree with this recommendation of Michael Moore.
  9. stevenpet

    stevenpet New Member

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    That's funny.

    I think that most people assume that their work is done once they get a judgment. In reality, they’re only half way there. It isn’t hard to get garnishments, liens, cash bank withdrawals, or repos, but it does take time.

    Where I live the police won't seek out a "Contempt of court, Failure to Appear" until after it's occurred three times. But if they’re pulled over for a routine traffic stop, they will be hauled in. After 3-4 failure’s to appear, the police will show up on their doorstep early on a Saturday or Sunday morning, when the odds of them being home are very high, and give them two choices: pay the bail right then and there in cash only, or sit in the county jail until someone else makes bail for them. By this point the amount is usually around $1,200-$2,400 and few people have this much cash lying around. The good news is, after keeping part of the money to pay their jail fees, most of the bail money goes to pay the judgment.

    An afternoon in county is a great motivator. Usually by the next day they pull up in their BMWs and have me paid. Once their check clears, I send them a satisfaction of judgment and it all goes away.
  10. YachtForums

    YachtForums Administrator

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    Scott,

    The best way to inform members is via the PM system. Word of mouth among the right people is a powerful tool. Where litigation is involved, it's in your best interest to keep the details confidential. Pending the outcome, it may be something to share, but consult an attorney first.

    BTW... I use the PM system regularly to convey information on builders, as well as yards. And I'm certain this has resulted in a little more business for some.
  11. SeaEric

    SeaEric YF Historian

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    The yachting community is quite small. And bad new travels way faster than good news. The worst thing that a marine business can do is to treat a customer poorly. Mistakes happen. The yard in question would be well served to quickly address this customer's situation, with hat in hand and, if necessary, checkbook open.
  12. NYCAP123

    NYCAP123 Senior Member

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    When I was in the collection business we considered Florida, Pa., Texas and California as "deadbeat states" because the laws on collection are one sided in favor of the debtor. They have no garnishment laws, jointly held property and accounts can't be touched, forget the house or the car if it's used to get to work, etc. etc. In certain areas the debt will be quashed and you may be finded for even the most mild collection attempts. My best advice is to keep it friendly and keep it out of the hands of attorneys unless we're talking about a lot of money AND you know of attachable assets.
  13. scott49

    scott49 Senior Member

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    Still trying to resolve. Turns out that the ship yard already has Moore & Company on there side. I had my lawyer up in Seattle send a quick little letter and have not heard back. You would think that they would at least respond!!
    Any other recommendations?
  14. NYCAP123

    NYCAP123 Senior Member

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    Negative. Once litigation has been mentioned communication ceases because it can only give you more evidence. You're done now. You have no recourse except to sue or forget it.
  15. YachtForums

    YachtForums Administrator

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    Scott,

    Please contact me via the PM system with the name of the yard.

    Carl
  16. scott49

    scott49 Senior Member

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    I will PM you the name

    Hi Carl A little history on what happen to my yacht. I had been looking at this boat and was going to purchase it from _______ yachts sale. Did sea trail and survey. All came out good on both but I got cold feet because I still own a 86 Burger and did not want to be a two boat owner. So I past on the purchase. A couple months go by and I run into the broker from ________ yacht sales and he tells me the boat has been repossessed and was I still wanting to purchase if the price was right. We made a offer the next morning. It took the Bank appox three weeks to get the deal accepted. Mean while the yard that the boat got towed too was working on the boat per the bank. Replacing the compressor and fixing the doors. The doors on port, starboard and going from the pilot house up to the fly bridge all needed to be removed and have new rollers installed as the doors would not hardly open. Parts had to be ordered,so when me and my captain looked at the boat it was under cover and they had plastic covering the opening. As the bank had to deal with attorney's Etc with all the repo paper work before they could close the deal it took about another 45 days. So over the next 45 days me and my captain were back in Seattle getting the burger ready to sell. When me, my wife, my captain and some friends flew back down to sign and take delivery of the boat it had been moved out side and the plastic had blow off and the pilot house was filled with water. It ruined the carpet,the wood around the base, the wall paper, all the books on the shelf and printer -fax machine. XXXXXX the project manager said he had been checking on the boat but never went inside. XXXXXX XXXXX came out and said he was sorry and had people come and try and clean up the mess. I called my Broker and he came over and was shocked on how bad it was. At that point is when XXXXXX XXXXX came out he looked around and he said that I purchase the boat as is. He then said that if I was going to make a big deal out of this that he would have the deal canceled, as his company had control and would advise the bank not to complete the deal. Then He accused me of not having the money and that the whole transaction took way to long as it was my fault. I told him that I had put the money in escrow almost two weeks ago. He really got mad at that point and said you take as-is or I will kill the deal. So under advisement I closed the deal and got the boat out of his yard. That is when I have called his office 4 times and he won't ever take my call or call me back. I am not asking for much but you would think that they would at least call back. One of the items I never pursued was the damaged done by who ever towed it to there ship yard. the port side had a 4 foot scratch thu the gelcoat and the starboard side has three large impact point thu the gelcoat ( about 3" each) These were not there when I was looking to purchase the yacht. So the answer to your question is XXXXXXXXX is the ship yard
    Scott
  17. HONGKONG

    HONGKONG Senior Member

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    Shakespeare might have said it first, but......

    A Dublin lawyer died in poverty and many barristers of the city subscribed to a fund for his funeral. The Lord Chief Justice of Orbury was asked to donate a shilling. "Only a shilling?" said the Justice, "Only a shilling to bury an attorney? Here's a guinea; go and bury 20 more of them."
  18. NYCAP123

    NYCAP123 Senior Member

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    IMHO, You have no recourse against the yard. You did not own the boat when the damage was done. When he said he would cancel the deal you should have taken that option without hesitation, and then negotiated a new deal on the boat "as currently is", putting the problem back into the hands of the bank and the yard. The care (neglect) this boat got as a repo is not unusual. You should have done a walk-through/survey before closing and negotiated the damages into the closing. You also then would have recourse for subsequent damages. This is not a legal opinion just the opinion of someone who has done a few deals pointing out the obvious. As for the yard not communicating, they're doing the right thing for their protection. What could they possibly gain from speaking with you? The good will is already gone. Save your money and your aggravation. Fix up you boat, enjoy it, and tell all your friends that you wouldn't ever bring a boat to XXXXXXX.
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2009
  19. Opcn

    Opcn Senior Member

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    I'm going to preface this by saying that I don't know maritime law, but for any other large valuable asset the key point would be when the damage occurred. If it was before he took possession of the boat but after the deal was struck (and as such the other party were taking care of the boat on his behalf) then he has a case. If the damage was done before he made the deal and he just hadn't bothered to look then no, he hasn't got a shred of a hope of a whisper of a prayer.

    Depending on the damage it might not be worth your time, a fax machine and some books are no big deal, the woodwork and carpet and wallpaper might be a big deal (and electronics, and structure behind it all).
  20. K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

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    Hi,

    Going by what you have posted here already this is not all you don't know much about.

    Please stick to posting answers to things that you do know about as many posters come here looking for constructive and factual answers for their questions and queries not just someone playing with the keyboard and themselves for the feel good factor by posting a rambling nonsensical reply.
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