Cost of a crew for an 80 foot yacht

In the past week I did in fact hire/give jobs to 5 other crew. A 4 day trip on a <50' delivery Capt $450 Day/Mate $250 day, a >7 day trip in the Exumas Capt $500 a day, a MATE delivery on a 95' MY for 6 days that tows a 34' tender $400 a day, and another Capt job through the exumas for 12 days on a 80' at $500 per day. Everyone is super busy right now, including myself, and the going rate for Captain is $450-500 and has been for a few years, and the going rate for a mate is $250 a day, SF guys are paying their mates $3-350 a day.

You said "I just hired an amazing Capt. with advanced engineering ticket to help move the boat" now you're saying he was a mate.......which was it?

It seems there is a lot of grandstanding here for the sake of supporting the industry financial parameters. As someone who hires, the rate is the rate the parties agree to. There is a rate standard by which the negotiations take place, but as the employer I am free to request my own rate standard from you, and you as the captain or mate or engineer or whatever are free to decline it. Market conditions are always going to sway that haggle one way or the other. It seems to make little sense to debate the rights to any level of pay or to dismiss an owner for rates he has been successful achieving.

Based on these market norms, I'll say that I have technically "underpaid" for superior performance and "overpaid" for dreadful results. Shame on the captain or mate. Kudos to the captain or mate. Good for me. Same on me. Everyone has a level of responsibility and decision here. It's a contract. Contracts are designed to be negotiated. The good ones get more work and good word of mouth. Everyone expects their rates to increase. Really bad ones (and there are plenty) get bad word of mouth and pay the price based upon lower offers or being disregarded completely.

No one gets a free lunch. Everyone has a responsibility and a role. And if the agreement is clear in advance, life goes on one way or the other.

But the owner claimed it was for a captain, now says it was for a mate. Always says it was for an engineer. So, we're dismissing misinformation. If one had the greatest licensed 500 Ton with STCW captain in the world at a lesser price, that would be something but that's not apparently what we have here.

We have an argument trying to take place where there should be no argument. I have a licensed captain aboard who is also a very fine mechanic. I'm aboard, running the vessel. Is he my captain? Is he my mechanic? Perhaps knowing that I am in charge of the vessel and out of respect to him I reference him as my engineer? Semantics. Does it really matter? Best yet, I just refer to him by name, as his title makes no difference to me. If it made a difference to him, he'd have said something.

But carry on.

The real question is was he hired as a captain or mate? Secondary is qualifications. They're relevant as pay is by both position and qualifications. Regardless, I don't consider standing up for the professionals in the industry to be grandstanding. You do and that's your right. Note, I made it clear I wasn't saying Danville's approach was wrong, just that it was one I disagree with.

As a forum for this industry though, let's be careful we don't encourage newcomers to look for discount captains.

Why does it matter to you "how he was hired"? Why does it matter to him to have a title? If I hire him as captain, and it's time to change the oil, does he do it, or does he outsource it to a yacht service firm? If I hire him as a mechanic, is he still permitted to toss a line, or take the helm for a shift?

I met with him. I discussed the challenges, scope, projects, expectations. We discussed solutions, plans, preferences. We discussed compensation. We struck a deal. The role is too broad for a title. His work is too good to be disrespected. It seems the only question regarding "how was he hired" is whether or not we are both honoring our responsibilities within the agreement. I suppose if he was the type that himself was hung up on semantics we never would have struck a deal. I seek confidence, performance, and teamwork/communication. I don't care much for egos. This is too enjoyable, too life important for egos to interfere.

I don't think at ALL that this is the conversion that was taking place when I chimed in. Bottom line, you almost ALWAYS get what you pay for. In fact, I recommended the investment in a quality mechanic aboard was worth its weight. As far as hiring a captain? I'm not going to recommend that to anyone with whom I have too little information regarding their ability to both "run the ship" as well as "run the project". Every boat is a project. The newer ones are just hiding the list of chores.

It matters because that's how pay rates are established in this and all industries and while a specific situation may have worked, that doesn't mean it's valid to be used for determining market rates.

I guess that I'm taking offense to this, and I may be in error as to understanding the intent of this forum. Pay rates are established by an open market, not by a forum. Is the role of this forum to be a lobby for captain's wages?

No, but the discussion here called for by the OP is for normal costs. Hiring an engineer to be a mate doesn't help provide normal costs for hiring a captain. I recently started a thread on crew costs but not on daily rates. I'm going to now add daily rates to it.

They will be my opinions based on my research using multiple resources, but some will always find lower or higher. Give me some time to do so, then argue all you want.

Cost of yacht crew..... - General Yachting Discussion | YachtForums: We Know Big Boats!

I don't care to argue. The theme of this thread has become a circular argument. It's one thing to understand market rates and trends. But these agreements are quite personal and usually very specific to the situation. Everyone is welcome to believe what they want to be paid with respect to someone's interpretation of a market norm, but when it comes to finding work and working responsibly under that agreement, well, that's between the two parties.

Sounds like Captain Mike is a bargain, but what is his definition of a day?

8 hour days?
$43 per hour..?
Captain rates here in South Florida starts at $50 per hour although some pontoon boat operators are trying to recruit brand new Captains @ $25 plus tips..

Saw a job yesterday moving an 80 foot boat for a few hours, $800. (Captain and Mate)

A FB group called South Florida Captains have daily job postings, ranging from small to big boats, lots of good information there, including the going rate

I agree that titles can be just semantics, and they really make no difference to me either. The question might be raised, however, in the case of an accident or casualty. You are aboard, you are running the vessel, are you the master of the vessel?

Very good point. We often have multiple licensed captains on board including both my wife and myself. We're very diligent about logging and about designating who the Master is. It may not be the person with the highest license or uppermost in the reporting relationship.

Yes it is, really kind of sad.

Crew costs represent a significant portion of the costs of yacht ownership.
As such, doesn’t the topic deserve a frank, earnest discussion? It is interesting to read input from all sides having a stake in this, and I think some very good opinions and viewpoints have been expressed.

I believe that if we are discussing Captains rates (or mate, or engineer), that they should be licensed in a capacity for the vessel they're running, hired as a Captain, and work as a Captain for a living, covered by the vessels insurance to discuss the rate. I have some owners that run their own 50-60' yacht, some are licensed, some go as a mate with me occasionally for free and allow me to charge for a mate for them. So does free count, NO. Does a unique situation where a retired yacht owner who needs no income and only takes the occasional delivery as Captain to keep themselves from being bored really count, no. I also know a Captain that has a 3000 ton master, and does daily Captaining now, he's very good as a Captain, but when it comes to taking care of everything on a typical yacht trip, one owner who he did a trip for described him as a "bumbling idiot" and he earned that title based on some of the things he did/did not do. Then the old saying also goes "Everyone charges what they're worth".

I also agree that a Captain that charges $350 per day in South Florida is a real deal. Also Judy's rate might be special as he might get a lot of work from her on a consistent basis and his rate may be different with others.