1998 40'SS structural integrity of forward Upper Deck.

Im happy to have found this forum. Looking through it , i see the search feature is going to help my when I am scratching my head, trying to find some obscure info on the 40' I purchased this month. Looking through the posts I had to laugh when I found the 12vAc light issue came up on here as well... that could have saved me a couple days...

Anyway, since I got no response after emailing Ocean for structural info of their older vessels, I thought someone on here may know as well. Ive also seen some other resources mentioned on older threads, and will contact some of them as well. I need to add fuel capacity to the vessel and am looking at options for where, other than the cockpit to stow it. The cockpit obviously gets very crowded with more than a 300g bladder sitting there. My eyes first took be to the bow to add another 300-500g badder, both out of the way, and counteracting the poor handling characteristics she'll get with just the stern loaded as well. My main concern is the strength of that roof/deck to handle 3000lbs strapped to it, its al ot as a static force, but with vessel movement it is amplified in many directions. The direct pressure is not tremendous, as ATLs 500g Fuelocker has a 70"x66" footprint, meaning the theyre would be around 0.6PSI but all the othere directions the total force exerts worries me. However a lot of my friends own slightly larger boats with bayboats to 23' cradled in that same position, but They may have special build consideration, just to do that, im not certain.

Thanks in advance for any insight, or other considerationsas to where to stow more fuel, until next year when Ill be adding more tankage.

Thank you for the quick response.

As far as the need for capacity, I'm basing it off of what the past owner told me, which was that it got fairly near the same economy as the 65ft Breaux I ran for 4 years, up until this past September. Though the boats are apples and oranges, and this holds 27kt as opposed to 15kt, I was intimately aware of every single drop i burnt in the other, based on distance.

That being said for a standard daily run 36nm out and back both vessels burned 155g +/- 5, and the areas I want to access several times a year are quite a bit further with the closest being 155nm from port, others I've already been to ae as much as 230nm, (in the other vessel, i could pull this off with a bit of educated speed control killing 80nm 1 way trolling for less than 850g) and one I'm looking at is pushing 350nm.

Obviously I wont know factual burn the way I drive until I get some sea time on her to familiarize myself with how she responds to the way I operate. Some things will change, i.e. I know my predecessor operated from the viewpoint that boats only had 2 load settings, 0% and 100%, and I just dont run that way, plus I'm fairly good at choosing opportune moments to slow it down if speed is of no importance.

However, IMO 410g of fuel capacity, that that this boat was built with, Isn't going to get me to the places I need, at least not for a round trip.

I know others have taken similar vessels out with a 300g on the stern and dumped it wen they got to the spot they planned to begin fishing, and came home on their own tanks after that, which is fine, but I plan to go farther and have already planned some much longer trips than is common around here. I also thought the bow might be a good place to help even out the ride caused by the bag on the stern... of course on second thought i did not take into account the wishbone effect created by those two forces fighting the buoyancy between them and, your right , doesn't seem safe for the entire structure in the long-run.

The spot you mentioned does have quite a bit of room, Ill have to look and see the capacity. Part of my does not care for it though, as I hate doing anything that creates a physical barrier between the engines and myself in the even of a malfunction somewhere, before I burned enough to pump the bag down, but I may have to reconsider it. Then there's always fire concerns....with non-metalic containers in engine rooms for oily substances....

Still All options are good ones to open my mind to the possibilities, thank you for another viewpoint

Yeah I didn't think about the fireboy

but one thing I didn't clarify, these are fishing trips to the middle of the Gulf, no fuel there, those distances are half the voyage as there's no fuel dock. As opposed opposed to islAnd hoppers or something.

This one has the 3126s in it with only 410g in saddletanks

I agree, and with more time, and capital I will. The void between the fishbox and Laz bulkhead looks very friendly for a 300ish tank, and would give me a great excuse to double fishbox capacity and install encapsulated chiller plates during the refit. Another place I thought of was under the Master bed, I haven't taken it apart yet to see what if anything is under it, and if it could be rerouted somewhere, and what you mentioned earlier, the space between motors would allow for another 200 or so and still be able to barely move around underway, in there.

The possibilities for a permanent solution are limitless with the same company that makes the bladders, I'm looking at , also making inserts to repair/replace any size tanks by filling the old void with an expanding bladder and using it as the tank from that point on. Time is a factor, as I have 2 trips so that duration ,and float plan , sold for May (if the Panic doesn't change things), as well as money, as I'm almost all in at this point, and contrary to what my projections were on closing, the tourism industry is going to struggle this year, so assuming I even survive, professionally, the impending disaster of a season, my new business is not going to be in a position to make that type of major, non essential refit until at least a year after I had planned on doing so.

As far as the bladders on fishing trips go, its pretty common for people, here ,on small boats, like this, to load bladders for their fishing trips of this type. The trick is to plan that the bladder on your stern should be of fairly close to the exact amount, that you anticipate using on your initial steam, and then pumping it into the main tank{s}, and stowing it, before you begin fishing, so that you can have the cockpit clear for fishing , both for everyone's freedom of maneuverability and for the safety of the bladder, which itself costs 3 as much as of the fuel it protects.

At the end of the day, I can keep these first few trips within 200nm offshore, utilize a 300 in the cockpit and wait for my opportunity to chop up a perfectly good boat to come, before venturing further...

I truly thank you for all your insight, you definitely brought up a few things for I had not considered, and sparked ideas that weren't there. I am thinking that would be the best place for a fresh water tank as well, however the fill opening is 2 bulkheads away, in the cockpit sink, seems odd to me to have a run like that, but hey, they reduced 120vAc to 12vAc instead of just running all the lights into 12vDc ... I'm no engineer, I just always wind up stuck in their booby traps!!!

Yeah I ran a 80ft Breaux for a few years, and also decked on it a few more as a teen, that had the 3000g tank under half the 36 person bunkroom. For years and years, there were various complaints and internet slander about the smell in there. During the first few months after I tool over it was a mission to find and fix it, and I would up locating many various pinholes caused by electrolysis in both the upper, outboard corners as well as every one of the fuel fills and vent pipes. someone had secured all that aluminum with either copper or brass hardware some 30+ years before, and it had long since finished being any type of support since what barriers had been there had rotten away, and began eating up so many parts of that poor boat. No one else ever located and fixed it, because it was behind false walls with extremely few and very tiny access panels. Shortly after we chased and patched all the spots, the smell was gone, and I believe never came back...

However that was an inspected aluminum hull with integral tanks. This is both the first fiberglass hull Ive ever run, and also the first uninspected vessel I've been on more than a week...I am not certain what,if any, differences an uninspected fiberglass boat might inherently face as far as if the boat you were on possibly was not vented properly and securely since the builders did not have to follow such strict guidelines? Also would a fiberglass boat ,and the limitations over welded metal, allow those vented fumes easier access back into a compartment? especially on a sportboat that possibly has circulation vents above the waterline but below the deck, side louvers, that the fuel vent may be located adjacent to, as opposed to above deck on a reverse elbow pipe vents?

The ER tank plumbed properly, would not only be an additional crossover, but one that is actually effective, as the same engineers decided all the fuel on this specific build at least, should try to crossover through 1/2 lines at the racor manifold, lol....also it becomes an effective water trap/sump.

As far as legalities go, the older I get the more I learn that my assumptions are wrong, were always wrong, and whatever event led me to believe them was wrong as well, as far as the law goes! However for three years I ran a 50' Delta in AK doing week long hunting charters 4-5 months out of the year, and we carried 6 barrels of diesel and 1 barrel of gasoline (zodiac) on deck of each boat. We were regularly checked by state and federal authorities, as our permit was a specific to a grey area called transporting, that was so very contested by the registered guides because of the loss of revenue unlicensed guides cost them, that we were always under heavy scrutiny. As well I always was rigged for hunting at both my topside and biannual USCG, and no one ever made remarks.But as I said Ive been on the wrong side of "not knowing any better" and lost with my honest ignorance plea defense, so back into the CFRs i go!

For the handling, yes its anticipated to be sluggish, loose speed, and adversely effect stability. I can accept all of those realities for the first half of a trip. one nice thing is, if planned properly is is self correcting until halfway though the trip when you SHOULD have used all the above deck or extra fuel.

Roger, Planning on that one for sure, borrowing a bag, for the stern, and weather permitting taking some friends out next week. As far as the lawyers go... yup, is all I can say. Honestly other than carrying a bag of somewhat explosive fuel on a moving deck of a boat with people not trained to be around it into unknown conditions at night, I don't see anything going wrong. lol. Honestly I don't see anything going wrong, that I would live through to attend the deposition. lol My worst concern would be a spill and the headache following protocol 200nm out would be vs. the much larger (i know from experience) headache of non-reporting violations.

Yeah bad business over there. I was coming in to San Diego, that morning, from a tuna trip and heard it on the radio while BSing with the crew...

Thanks for the tip on the fill necks, something extra for my to-do list tomorrow. I already didn't like the vent location. the first time i filled her, last week, there was no burp and no way to contain a hiccup ,not that I knew where it was anyway beforehand.

No, your what is yanking your chain or anyone else. What you going to want to look up how much is "fishing the Texas floaters" the short answer is that we have oil wells that are semi-submersible in float in between 3000 and 10000 feet of water outside the Shelf. The closest one of my home Port is 127 miles away, but it's hit to hard. Others are distances of 155 181 192 211 Etc on out there to the one that I would like to go to which is pushing 350 nautical miles. We actually have some of the richest fishing grounds in the world that nobody knows about here in Texas believe it or not it's common for all types of boats to head out there for multi-day trips to load up on yellowfin tuna go Bill fishing excetera excetera excetera. But when I was younger before these rigs were in place oh, we can catch a hundred fifty pound yellowfin tuna within 30 miles of the beach oh, they really come in that close and it certainly not consistent, now that they have these homes permanently well offshore that are always stocked up with food. I'm actually fairly well known in my area for taking multi-day trips out there on larger boats with more people, I'm just new to the luxury side of the equation oh, and some people already signed up enjoy fishing with me. In addition to those spots is also a few areas breathtaking stunning Beauty over 200 miles from our court, while not being anywhere near that far offshore, that are unlike anything else in the world and honestly I just like going there because there's a beautiful places that offer opportunities I never see except for the times I get there one thing about it you never know what you're going to say when you get out of those type of area is Less Traveled. But don't feel bad I always wait for people to call PS when they put saltwater fishing in.

Don't worry though, very few people realize what we have here Jonathan said before and I always said that the best fishing in the world that no one knows about. You're not the only person I've had be shocked both by the fact that we have such amazing fisheries, and the depths of our depravity for what we go through access it

But I'm going to have to look up information on that suction cup catcher until I reroute those events thank you very much for that tidbit I was not aware. Most things are going to catch me up as far as taking care of a yacht for the first time in my life, are going to be all the differences between big boats small boats and work boats and pleasure grabs. I'm a quick study oh, but the learning curve is pretty damn steep here so wish me luck

Please pardon all my typos today, I'm stuck using my talk-to-text Street, and I'm worse with it than I am with my thumbs

Thank you very much for that link I didn't even know such a thing existed. Simple enough to make as well, with nice pictures provided on their website.

Yeah I feel you, I can totally understand thinking it's a courageous proposition. I won't be able to go anywhere near as many of these trips as I did back when I ran larger party boats, and hope to get at least a half-dozen out career, which is a far cry from 30 to 40 a year I would normally run. However as you mention the weather dictate so very much really small bugs that everything has to line up perfectly with a weather window the week you want to go oh, and also it's cost-prohibitive because so few people can split the bill. I just want to make sure I'm in a position to run them when the opportunity arises, as I said I've already got two sold. As important, if not more so, then the charters is also my personal enjoyment of getting out there and doing it, so there's quite a few times I want to be able to take her out with my friends

Adult is a weird place when it comes to weather, we get consistent heavy 4 to 6 ft chop throughout the year which is certainly not any kind of fun for anybody in a small boat, rarely do we get the enormous Breakers or even swell that you're familiar with on the Atlantic. I've never personally ever actually been in the open Atlantic, but I noticed some degree is similar to the Pacific which I spend a considerable amount of time in. Night and day difference with a small body of water I'll tell you that much.

During the primary time when we would do multi-day trips, we have a fairly consistent and predictable set of weather Windows following each major Northern oh, that wall it's easy to be wrong, or typically pretty is it to discern which ones are going to be long enough to do these things and not. Don't get me wrong I've been caught up two or three times and stuff that I wish to hell I'd never gone, couple of the times weren't even in the forecast so I know what you talking about.

It does not look like anyone is going to be chiming in soon on the topic of structural integrity, however let's continue this conversation in private message for him so as not to clog up to Forum back and forth banter