Click for Perko Click for Burger Click for Nordhavn Click for Westport Click for Westport

Dock design

Discussion in 'General Yachting Discussion' started by Dark horse, Jul 10, 2024.

  1. Dark horse

    Dark horse Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2024
    Messages:
    35
    Location:
    Florida
    So I’m having a dock built as we speak. It has a walkway out to deep water and then a platform at the end. They are sinking poles right now for the walkway. The platform at the end will be 8 feet by 20 feet. I havnt bought the yacht yet, but it will be 40-60 feet long. Questions

    1. Do I want a “T” at the end or a “L”?
    2. I plan to sink some poles in the bay out from the dock to tie the yacht. How many and how should they be arranged?
  2. MM3

    MM3 Member

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2016
    Messages:
    32
    Location:
    New York
    why wouldn’t your dock have cleats?
  3. ranger58sb

    ranger58sb Senior member

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2013
    Messages:
    924
    Location:
    Chesapeake Bay, USA

    Unless you're a Brit/Aussie/Kiwi/etc... and it's a sailboat... when it's only 40'60' long, it's just a boat.

    :)

    Can't speak well to your design, but usually I'd guess you'd want piles on the dock side as far forward as the bow, with maybe an intermediate or two, and piles on the offside at least at bow, mid-ship (at least 2x), and stern. Assumes your 8x20 platform will be nearest the stern of where you dock the boat.

    And in general, you'll want to be planning for storm* tie-up, as with doubled bow and stern lines, multiple springs in both directions, etc. (* I don't mean hurricane tie-up, just normal storms. Hurricane solution is a whole different discussion.)

    -Chris
  4. Dark horse

    Dark horse Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2024
    Messages:
    35
    Location:
    Florida
    It will definitely have cleats.
  5. Dark horse

    Dark horse Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2024
    Messages:
    35
    Location:
    Florida
    Should I dock the boat with the stern against the platform? (Or close) Or should I plan on the platform to be on the side of the boat? (Near the stern) How wide should I make the piles?

    Is there no way to quote two people on this forum?
  6. Pascal

    Pascal Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2008
    Messages:
    8,646
    Location:
    Miami, FL
    Post a plan or diagram.

    if you plan on tying a 40-60 footer along side a 20’ long pier, you will need additional pilings. Where to place the pilings depends on which way you will dock the boat which should be bow facing the prevailing stronger winds or waves. If the chop comes from an open body of water, you want to be bow into the chop towards the opening of the bay. This reduces strain on the lines and prevents potential issues with water being forced up the exhausts

    it’s also much easier to dock into the wind.

    keep in mind that most boats are easier to board from close to the stern instead of amidship so putting the small dock in the middle isn’t going to work well

    as to offside pilings, 3 should be fine, bow, midship and and stern. Make sure they try far enough so they keep the boat off the dock. Typical beam of a 60 footer is about 18/19’ so you want the pilings to be at least 25’ from the dock.

    impossible to really answer your question without a diagram and chart of your area.
    rocdiver likes this.
  7. Dark horse

    Dark horse Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2024
    Messages:
    35
    Location:
    Florida
    The bay is big. North to south, maybe a little over a mile. East to west, 20-30 miles. The nearest opening to the ocean is probubly 18 miles, so I don’t think it is a factor. Wind is mostly from the southwest. The platform will be east to west.

    if I put piles with a 25’ width, is that going to be a problem if I get a smaller boat? (Like a 42’)

    This is probably a stupid question, but how do you get a line on those poles where there’s no dock? Do you have to maneuver the boat up to them and put a line on loosely and then tighten them up to center the boat? Do you “lasso” the poles? Do I want cleats on the poles?
  8. Pascal

    Pascal Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2008
    Messages:
    8,646
    Location:
    Miami, FL
    It’s always a little harder the first time you set up the lines so yes you have to get the boat close to the pilings to set them up. Pilings have wooden hooks to hang your lines on when you leave. When you come back they re ready.

    in a storm you set the lines so the boat is kept off the dock, in the middle of possible. In normal conditions you have the line set so it’s a foot from the dock.
    Dark horse likes this.
  9. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2004
    Messages:
    13,643
    Location:
    Satsuma, FL
    I do recommend a full length plus deck along side your boat. It makes so much so much easier.
    I would offer a picture but I'm currently anchored in the Ortega river.

    Our L (T over lap) shape wood dock was over $100K for two lil boats.
    We submitted wind resistance of our boats and the dock was engineered for our 60 and 75 foot boats.
    Then built our engineered wood dock.
    Thru bolts and cross bracing.
    The outside dock runs 90 feet parallel to the shore.
    The 70 on the inside for our Bert.
    The whole 90 for the 75 Hatt on the outside.
    I learned on my previous docks not to land & tie cross current.
    Then the height of our dock was leveled for mean gunnel height to just step on the boat.
    Then,, the height of the piles extend past the dock another ten feet up in case the 100 year flood level is exceeded.
    Most piles are 50 plus feet long by 12-13-14 plus inches wide.
    2 x 5 pile dolphins on the out side of the dock for the 75.
    2 x single dolphins to guide us in on the inside.
    Mobile home anchors scattered on shore.
    We have the scope, angle and plenty to tie to when the wind and tide (flood) picks up.

    2 x 100 Amp power pedestals were raised ten more inches over the dock " just in case".
    Thank you Edison Electric Supply.
    Oh, the local power company had to install a special transformer to service the house and dock, To the lot, we have 500 amp, single phase transformer service.
    200 for the house, 100 for each power pole and the last 100 just to make sure.
    Thank you Clay Power.
    Funny,,, Clay Power (another department) came back 6 months later investigating high power consumption, Suspecting an inside plant farm, Josie walked the inspector to the back yard. Pointed out up to 16 different ACs running on the two boats. Plus water heaters and galleys.
    Dugh-ah

    No direct storm hits but a few crossing the state and skippers on the east coast storms, have caused us flooding and high winds.
    No worries.
    Oh, when the power goes out, both boats have 2 gen-sets each and our Bert has an 230/50 outlet to feed the house.

    Life in the swamp is unique, not a problem if your prepared.
    We may never bug-out for any storm.

    Our boats insurance companies luv us.
  10. Dark horse

    Dark horse Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2024
    Messages:
    35
    Location:
    Florida
    That is very impressive, but I’m in to my dock for 60k allready.
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 12, 2024
  11. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2004
    Messages:
    13,643
    Location:
    Satsuma, FL
    Here we go. Found some pictures here on the boat computer.
    20190422_143653a.jpg 20190422_143650a.jpg
    Yep, built April 2019
  12. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2004
    Messages:
    13,643
    Location:
    Satsuma, FL
    Scary to think of it this way; The dock has already paid for itself within 40 months.
    Oh, one of my specs was not correct, its 80 feet long.
    20190422_143520a.jpg 20190422_143545a.jpg 20190422_143526a.jpg
    These dolphins are not going anywhere.
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2024
  13. ranger58sb

    ranger58sb Senior member

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2013
    Messages:
    924
    Location:
    Chesapeake Bay, USA
    Usually nearer the stern, because usually that's where you'd board the boat. Can vary.

    Just keep using the Reply button.



    Do it right or do it cheap. The dock can protect your boat. Or not. The layout can make docking (and some service) easier. Or not.

    -Chris
  14. Dark horse

    Dark horse Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2024
    Messages:
    35
    Location:
    Florida
    Are you renting it out? Is a “dolphin” a free standing pole? Or is that reserved for a multiple pole setup?

    My dock has to go out 210 feet before I even start the dock. (Shallow water)
  15. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2004
    Messages:
    13,643
    Location:
    Satsuma, FL
    20210526_172039a.jpg
    Savings in paying dock rent at the Jax marinas.
    For the two boats, slip was $2500 a month. Way more now.
    Then commercial rate electricity.

    Free standing. Offers some strain in keeping the boat off of the dock during ugly weather.
    Those are 5 pole dolphins. One surrounded by 4. On the outside of the dock ends.
    The inside slip has two single pole dolphins and a few mobile home anchors set well in the yard, another 20 feet away.

    I've done a long dock at a previous house. The marinas in Jax luv long docks also.
    I'm getting to old for long hikes.
    20210526_172039a.jpg
    This picture shows it is not a long walk on the dock and,,
    When I took this picture, I was standing on our house's back steps.
    Dark horse likes this.
  16. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2004
    Messages:
    13,643
    Location:
    Satsuma, FL
    The above pic also shows a good point of laying on the inside of the L (or T).
    Passing wakes push you aweigh from the dock vs on it.

    The local bass & pontoon boats don't offer the bad wake as in Jax,
    but every now & then, some swamp head does come by with the mother-in-law planted in the stern and bow pointing to Mars,,
    Still as other places,, with out a clue what he is doing (other than dating the mother-in-law while wife is working).
    Yes, even in the swamp we have real soap operas..
  17. Dark horse

    Dark horse Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2024
    Messages:
    35
    Location:
    Florida
    Ok guys, I have a dock. Now I need some more information. Is there any special cleats I should put on the poles? I assume I put them on the inside in a vertical fashion. I’ve only seen cleats on a deck, but my deck is plastic. If that’s best, I can figure something out. I don’t mind paying more if I only do it once. I assume they need to be stainless? Is there a certain size I want?

    Also, is there a bumper that can be affixed to the poles so I won’t have to use the hanging ones at my dock.

    Is there a favorite supplier for this kind of stuff?

    One other question, my dock has one step from the walkway to the platform. (16” lower”). Should I build a step there or a ramp? Obviously, a hand truck would be easier down a ramp. Is it that big a deal?
  18. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2004
    Messages:
    13,643
    Location:
    Satsuma, FL
    There is nothing stronger than a couple of wraps around the pile. We don't have any cleats on our dock.
  19. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2004
    Messages:
    13,643
    Location:
    Satsuma, FL
    Currently I'm using the 3 1/2" Dock Guard strips from WestMarine.
    My buddy is floating big asp fenders between the piles and his hull.
    On my previous dock I used 4" PVC pipe. Later used 4" green pipe (I found somewhere:rolleyes:).
  20. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2004
    Messages:
    13,643
    Location:
    Satsuma, FL
    What walkway?
    What platform?
    Can you send a picture or explain differently?