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Man D2848 LE403 coolant level alarm.

Discussion in 'Engines' started by kev cribb, Sep 24, 2020.

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  1. mapism

    mapism Senior Member

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    Roger wilco. I should be there next Sunday.
  2. kev cribb

    kev cribb New Member

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    Hi ok so little update
    The black boxes that Mapism mentions are there with the small boxes on the side that deal with sensors. When the ignition is turned on the 3 lights light up red. One shows you have a temperature sensor the other two are depending on if you have one or two level sensors. What ever is connected and working turns green so on my good engine I end up with 3 green lights. On my bad engine I end up with only one green light for my temperature. Even with the sensors not connected they turn green on my good engine. But not on my bad engine they stay red. Is the problem somewhere else. Will carry on trying
  3. alvareza

    alvareza Senior Member

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    Maybe this will help. Diagram from the manual with a little explanation on how it works.

    upload_2020-9-27_8-37-32.jpeg
  4. Beau

    Beau Senior Member

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    They are not "elecronic" in the modern sense, correct. But there are some sensors in there. I just learned for instance that they will sense, at higher engine RPM's , if the tranny pressures are way low. It then sets off an alarm. But they are not diagnostic ?.
  5. Beau

    Beau Senior Member

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    Interpretation please. What does that tell us; disconnected from the probes/sensors, one alarm sounds and the other doesn't? It seems the sensors are not the issue? Dunno
  6. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    Then the alarm monitoring circuit board is bad for the starboard engine or the display at the helm with the alarm lights. Do you have digital hour meters? If so are they reading correctly? Try swapping the connections at the 2 displays on the dash with the lights and see if the problem stays on the starboard side or moves to the port side.
  7. kev cribb

    kev cribb New Member

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    Stbd engine ?
    but that’s doing what it should
    turn key
    Alarm sounds light comes on 2-3 seconds later alarm stops light goes out
    In engine room lights on sensor box change from red to green and engine starts

    Port engine
    Turn key
    Alarm sounds light comes on and stays on. Alarm sounds continuously
    In engine room lights on sensor box stay red
    Engine starts fine.

    No change weather the sensors are connected or not same result. So NOT sensors.

    Alarm monitoring circuit board I take it behind the dash
    I have checked the wiring behind the ignition keys and all seems fine
    Checked behind the alarm light panel with all the alarms on. All seems fine no loose wires or frayed bits moving behind the dash next.

    Please keep going guys all ideas welcome and I will work through them lol.
    Man engineer says it’s an electricians job.
    Electrician says it’s an man engine problem grrrrrrrrhhhhhhhhhhh !!!!!,,,,,,!!!,!,
  8. Beau

    Beau Senior Member

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    I'm still thinking you have a short up the line. Have your voltage meter handy - whether something "burned" out, or other wised failed, you've got juice going to that alarm. Track it back to the source?

    Can someone with more knowledge than I (everyone?) confirm how the sensor works the circuit. Do it close the circuit or open the circuit when its in a "non-alarm " state, and there is sufficient coolant in the expansion tank to cover it? That schematic and the OPs comments that the wires are disconnected from both sensors seem at odds?
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2020
  9. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    Alarm monitoring boards are located in the large MAN black box in the engine room. On yours, the actual displays "may" be the computer/board/display everything all in one, if you have the displays with a row of like 6 lights.
  10. chesapeake46

    chesapeake46 Senior Member

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    Can you get to the lamp and buzzer or relay with a multi meter ?
    Can you get to the sender with a multi meter.
    How hard is it to remove the signal wires from the sender ?

    You should read 24VDC across (+) & (-)
    If (S) is disconnected from the sensor, you should read zero across (+) and (S)
    Assuming (S) is not common to any other component.

    You say the alarm stays on even if the sensor is disconnected.
    If sensor is disconnected, & you read 24 VDC across (+) and (-) then the cable has failed.

    I don't know the distance but you can get three conductor signal cable and connect it in place of your existing cables temporarily to see if the problem goes away.
    This signal cable is pretty cheap - you could even use regular single strand wire from Home Cheapo just for a test but be sure you mark them on both ends or get different colors as you don't want to goof up the polarity.

    If the problem persists then you know it's not the cable

    The symbol with the diode may be a relay.
    does the manual have symbol definitions ?
    Possibly the relay might operate the buzzer and is stuck closed.
    Swap relays with the other engine.

    If the signal is as simple as that drawing then it seems easy to trouble shoot.
    If, indeed the cornucopia of information that is "MAPISM" is correct and there are no real " Electronics" present.

    I like mechanical engines for the same reason he does.
  11. mapism

    mapism Senior Member

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    I agree, what the OP is reporting appears weird, and intuitively I also can't think of any other reason for the port alarm behaviour, other than a short somewhere along the wires.
    Either from engine to the black box, of from there to the dashboard, but I'm just guessing.
    Will check on my boat when I'll be back onboard...
  12. mapism

    mapism Senior Member

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    No way.
    The display you have in mind is the so-called MMDS, made by Boening for MAN electronically controlled engines.
    I don't think it's even possible to retrofit that display to mechanical engines, because even the probes are different.
    What I suppose KC must have in his dashboard is a set of analogue gauges, plus an array of red lights which go off together with a strong acoustical buzzer.
    The only LCD bit probably is the small hour meter embedded in the lower part of the rev counter, nothing else.
    Thanks God! :)
  13. mapism

    mapism Senior Member

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    Far from wishing to teach you to suck eggs, but just in case you didn't consider this:
    Don't assume that since the engine starts and runs fine, there's nothing wrong with the coolant (or anything else).

    I mean, it's rather likely that what you've got is a sensor defect of some sort and there's nothing really wrong, in this case.
    BUT generally speaking, even if you would have no coolant in the circuit, no oil, no raw water circulation, or any other serious trouble, your engines would still start and run till they physically can, because all warnings are just that, warnings.
    There is no protection/limp mode or other electronic tricks to CYA, as with more modern blocks.
  14. kev cribb

    kev cribb New Member

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    Hi mapism
    No I realise that but I am happy there is coolant. I don’t want to use the boat but do want to sort the problem out.
    I do keep thinking the problem lies in the black sensor box on the side of the larger box. But can’t even find out who makes them to buy a new one. I’m slowly working my way through the boat. But then remembered I will have to do the same at the flybridge controls lol doh !
    Also woke up wondering if it’s the stop switch that is causing the problem ?
    I’m in danger of this problem taking over my life because I hate it when I can’t work it out.
  15. kev cribb

    kev cribb New Member

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    Correct
  16. kev cribb

    kev cribb New Member

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    Ok quick update to all you good people who have tried to assist with this one.
    Think we may of found the problem. I had a marine electrician onboard doing a quick job for me who said he would have a quick look and see if he could do anything for me whilst I was at work in relation to this.
    Turns out he only worked for sunseeker as an electrician, how lucky.
    Anyway he did much the same as I did from one end to the other. When he removed the small black electrical sensor box out came some water. From where who knows but it’s looking like that could be it. Just waiting for prices now and he is going to see if he can repair my one. Fingers crossed
  17. mapism

    mapism Senior Member

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    Good to hear that the problem is on its way to be fixed, but I'm a bit confused.
    What do you mean exactly by "small black electrical sensor box"?

    I suppose you aren't talking of the one in my post #9, because that's not so small.
    But I can't recall to have any other black boxes in my boat...

    Or do you possibly mean the smaller box attached to the side of the larger one which I posted, where the lights are located?
    I never opened that one, so I have no idea of how it looks inside!
  18. kev cribb

    kev cribb New Member

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    Yes the smaller one on the side with the lights. As per your picture. I have had one quote for a replacement of $800. It’s literally a small pcb and not much else. Will update once it’s sorted.
  19. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    Have you figured out how it got water in it (in the Engine room) to begin with?
  20. kev cribb

    kev cribb New Member

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    No not really although this could be it. On a 2002 Sunseeker manhattan56 on the port side in the saloon is a vertical sliding electric window when it opens it slides down into its own fibreglass box. This box has a small drain hole in it and hose which connects to the drainage system. This allows any water when washing down or raining and goes down past the window rubber to drain off. Last year during winter my drain plug got bunged up ? So the bin filled with water and over flowed. This is more or less directly above where my port black box is. It’s all I can come up with I’m afraid. My engine room is otherwise always dry and I did some changes to the window bin and it’s fine and doesn’t do it anymore.