Gunboat 66 – the ultimate fast cruiser?

Hello Brian,

Given a business a second chance by using the Chapter 11 (we have a similar system in Europe) is ok with me. But if I did understand this subject correctly, they have moved important assets (for example the molds) to an area of different jurisdiction, in order to safe it from the bankrupty mass. In our law that is called bankruptcy fraud and taking orders and deposits, when already unable to build boats due to the bankruptcy, is called culpable delay in filing for insolvency. Sorry, people acting like this, do not need a second chance, they need to be penalized. We had a company in northern Germany (the case was widly discussed here on YF) acting like this. Boaters have brains like elephants, they do not forget. After the restart of this company none of their old customers would even buy a sandwich from them.

On several new designs of larger catamarans (power and sail) a front cockpit on the bridgedeck between the
deckhouse and the trampoline is becoming fashionable. That is ok for nice weather conditions and flat sea. But as the main steering and handling location on a boat not my cup of tea. I would rather use this space as an enclosed storage locker.

IMHO "There is no need to be soaking wet to enjoy sailing".

On a larger cat, lets say 50 feet and upwards, the flybridge solution with an additional steering position in the salon is in my opinion the most elegant and most practical solution. On larger boats above 60 feet with 2 wheels on both sides of the flybridge.

And a fast and agile Cat does not have to be spartan inside. I am aware, creating a comfortable and practicable layout for a multihull is quite a task. As most larger production cats are used for cabin charter in warmer climats and those charter companies do not want to pay to much for their boats, the yards squeeze the max. amount of cabins into those hulls and save costs where ever they can.

My favorite catamaran in the pre flybridge aera of cat design was the Lagoon 670. We almost bought one but Lagoon stopped the production. A very good looking, fast and agile boat with a very comfortable and luxury interior. It was the apex of this design aera.







But time has changed and the design has changed with it. The Flybridge design has taken over.
This Lagoon 620 being shorter than the 670 is a real giant in comparison to the 670 as far as internal volume is concerned. It is still a fast boat but not a racer. Not a Ferrari but a V12 Mercedes Sedan .





If only those french yards could develope an attitude towards more build quality and precision.
Btw. this big boat is not more expensive than a Gunboat of similar size.

A catamaran is a special breed among pleasure boats. You either like them or not. But with the above stories about Gunboat, I would rather hesitate to go into business with them.

Brian, multihulls are a very interesting subject. If we will not bore the YF community to death, I would love to discuss this theme in detail.

Sorry, the blow boater stroke again .

Why can't you find reputable sail boat builders to promote instead. Anyone who would buy from Gunboat or Johnstone would be making a very unwise move. If they'd do this twice, what makes one think they wouldn't do it a third time?

My issue is that on a site like this we need to promote boating and part of that we can do through promotion of reputable boat builders.

I can build my opinion obout this company only from the posts above and from what is available on the web. Obvioulsly some very unhappy clients where left behind.

But one can get very easily into trouble, when working with companies in Asia, especially in PR of China and Taiwan, Korea and Japan. And also India is getting on speed, building up a solid repution as an unreliable and untrustworthy partner in business. And the biggest problem is, you have no chance in court in those countries as a foreigner. I have had to learn it the hard way to work and deal with those countries.

We have our problems with the American protectionism too (Jones act) but these are clear cut rules and we can live with that. We are never been tricket or fouled, just tough business. My ships have to go some crazy routes in order to stay legal on your side of the pond . But dealing with companies in Asia is always prone for surprise. Without closest supervision, they make a fool out of you, faster than a breath. So, Gunboat may have got initially completely innocently into trouble.

But Brian has promoted some very reputable yards and high quality boats on this forum. Just lately he posted info about the St. Francis 50 catamaran. I personally have inside knowledge about this yard, its owner and this boat. I have sailed this boat and visited the yard in St. Africa some 10-12 years ago.

For an owner couple wanting to sail around the world for some years, this would be my number one choise.



Not a racer but seaworthy to the highest degree, solid, high quality construction, KISS principle with built in systems and semi custom, means can be build to the clients needs. The yard owner has sailed this boat himself from St. Francis Bay in St. Africa to a boat show in Florida.

Brian, if interested, PM me. I have tons of pictures, specs and plans about this boat.

Brian, a couple points:
a) When you have to resort to Confuse, Delay and Mire in Clarifications as your defense tactics, you KNOW you're in the deep. You can plausibly stand "unconvinced" that the sun rises from the east every morning for a many pages discussion, so what?
You might be contributing to a specialized dispute-techniques community with that, but definitely not to the astronomical one. Getting my drift?

b) There is no chance in the would you have missed all the Gunboat discussions, here and elsewhere. There is no chance in the world you're not aware of the general attitude out of those. Pray tell, what kind of discussion you expected with the "Gunboat - the ultimate..." title?

I probably have naturally easier time at it as a Russian... takeaway is, "unreliable" and "untrustworthy" are too narrow a terms indicating too narrow a thinking, no offense intended. Entirely within the "golden billion" "fair rules". As soon as you shift the point of view to a more globalized one, (for example, a lot of contract culture in the West comes from high-enough-above-starvation level life for long enough that "walking out of a deal" is a fair option. It isn't so much in eastern cultures, where no deal today could much more readily mean no food tomorrow.) it becomes much easier to understand and empathise. And it's crucial part, to empathise when you rough someone up, set multiple control levels and heavy fines )))

This is not the forum for politics but this statement above has to be answered.

I was not talking about little backyard companies which have to starve due to western arrogance. I was talking about big, very big companies which are heavily subsidized by their governments or even government owned. Yards that build more than hundred large vessels a year and sell them at a final price, where a "western" yard could not buy the plain steel for. About countries which disregard all international rules and regs including copyrights, design and patent protection. And a foreigner has no chance in court in one of those countries.

They ruin and eliminate complete industries in our countries. And a cultural based attitude, where it is not fraud action to fool a "long nose" (that is what they call us Europeans and Americans). They are only loosing their face, when getting cought. In trading, I call this unfair competition, when a far eastern shipping company can transport a shipload of boxes from Asia to Europe for less money, than I pay for the harbour fees and handling charges of my ship.

We have set several control levels when having ships built over there and I mean very close control but we still catch them trying to fool us behind our back.

The biggest mistake the western world makes, is using Asia as a remote workbench because of lower labour costs. With the transfer of know how, we give them the rope, with which they are hanging us.

This is not cynical, these are facts. I know what I am talking about, I have to deal with those countries for more than 30 years now.

And I am very sorry ArcanisX, your country is not much better at the moment.

End of politics, back to to boats.

Well you got one thing right and everything else wrong. The right thing is,

Surely, you don't like Chinese\Indian\Russian\Whatever business practices? NP, don't deal there. OH, but you want the cheap labor and/or huge markets? NP again, short range of very simple options: a) adapt, and know what you are paying with for that cheapness b) get burned and complain.

The rest of your post, well, from merely ignorant (the repeated reference to "international laws". Sorry to say, not international, rather, forced by the first world upon the third. China has the power to ignore copyright? It does. How is that for a perfectly fine alternative set of rules to you? Well I guess not too good, but that's the reality, so either ignore it and move to ivory towers of false moral superiority, or respect and adapt, even if you don't like) to outright smelly and offensive, like wrapping the whole post in the mandatory "I am not a racist, but..." template (google it up), and never missing a completely unrelated pun to "my country".

I honestly don't understand how you've been dealing with these countries for 30 years and still hold this degree of bitterness towards it. I mean, I don't argue, cheaters and thieves. Spare yourself the worry and bother 25 years ago, stop dealing with them!!!!! No? Want the cheap labor and/or big markets?
Then please, don't be such a hypocrite, put an effort in understanding, not in blaming (the obvious blame, too. I mean, what kind of 30-years-expertise you are sharing with us stating that Chinese don't respect IP and their courts are useless? Huh?). You don't have to agree and\or accept (I for one sure don't), but you have to try to understand, if only to make 30 years of dealing with the whole other culture any productive...

I just stripped this thread and it being closed. Let's get back to boats!