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Book on Anchors

Discussion in 'General Yachting Discussion' started by JWY, Dec 9, 2015.

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  1. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    I don't understand that either and I've anchored many times.
  2. Opcn

    Opcn Senior Member

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    Cleaning up a job site is also dead simple, and something people should do with no problem, but plenty of lazy people don't. You've got a good system worked out (and it wasn't hard) and you just do it. But if you were lazy and didn't have a good system then the thought of laying out 8:1 instead of 4:1 might seem like twice the work. That is almost certainly why people who should know better aren't anchoring well.

    Norsemen: Yes, I left about 12 months ago, hopefully I'll be back in a few years.
  3. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    What work? Almost everytime I anchor the chain comes up clean. If you want spray it with the hose on it's way in, which is pretty easy as well. If the chain is extra mucky the stuff still sprays off easily and that's less than 1% of the time from what I've seen. Most times on yachts under 80' I don't even rinse the chain on it's way in and just give the anchor locker a good spray down once back at the dock.
  4. Opcn

    Opcn Senior Member

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    I feel like you guys are really honing in on the part that was not my point. You seem to be trying to convince me of something I already know (that anchoring is not actually hard) based on the fact that I think some people treat it like it's hard because they are lazy.
  5. olderboater

    olderboater Senior Member

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    You lost me with this entire post which makes it sound first like it's a tremendously hard job and then like all the problems are laziness. Mostly, I didn't understand the "link by link" as that makes it sound like you're bringing it in by hand, one link and wash, another link and wash. This was where I got terribly confused as to what your point was. Perhaps, you could state another way for us now just what the point is or the multiple points.
  6. Rodger

    Rodger Senior Member

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    anchor problems
  7. Opcn

    Opcn Senior Member

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    When people are being lazy simple things seem hard to them. Cleaning up a job site is really simple work, but when people are being lazy they think about all the little things that go into it and it seems like a huge ordeal. Hanging up laundry is really easy, but to a lazy teenager they have to go and get the hangers, which means pulling them out from among clothes that are hanging, and if they knock one down they have to bend over and pick it up and then they have to hang it back on the hanger. Then they have to go to the pile of clean clothes and put them on the hangers and make sure that they are hanging straight, then they have to make some room in the closet to hang the clothes and that might mean taking down clothes on hangers and rehanging them on the bar on the other side of the bracket. etc.

    The point I was trying to illustrate was that laziness is a result of simple tasks seeming harder than they really are, so people end up not doing them. I felt like I had illustrated that point fairly well when I explained the simple task of anchoring in a way that made it sound hard, even though we all know that it's not. I can see how that didn't come across fully, so in my response I explained that that was what I was doing, and that I know that anchoring is simple (I've in fact done it a few dozen times).

    If it takes a minute and a half of talking to your partner, and spraying the hose, and winding in a 4:1 it's going to take three minutes to wind in 8:1, "link by link" because you've got twice as many links out, and they go through your anchor roller one at a time. Lots of people think that they have better things to do with that 90 seconds. Laziness. Complacency.

    This is opposed to a paper operation. If they were sitting down and writing a test and you asked them how much chain they should put out they would probably answer something like 8:1, because there is no extra difficulty involved in writing an 8 versus a 4 (it is actually a slightly easier number for most people). But when it comes time to do it, it's a non zero difficulty. It's not a great difficulty, it's not an insurmountable task, it's not one of the most difficult things you will do all day, or all evening, or even in that hour probably, but it is a non-zero difficulty. The word difficult can mean different things, and I feel like it should be clear that I was using it in the non-zero difficulty manner rather than the extremely hard to do and laborious manner.
  8. olderboater

    olderboater Senior Member

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    I think there is far more lack of training than laziness in managing anchors and this book could give some people the knowledge they need to develop better skills. Frankly, I'm lazy, but it only takes pushing a button and having the hose handy if needed. Now, one thing I think is very valuable is convenience of windlass controls.
  9. Pascal

    Pascal Senior Member

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    From what I ve seen over the years the people who use too little scope and drag down the anchorage don't rinse their rode so the point it moot. Come and think of it, I woudl say most people don't bother rinsing especially when you have the roller and chute build below deck.

    I think lwck of scope is mostly ignorance and also lack of markings. So many boats don't hwve markings on their rode, making it hard to know how much is deployed
  10. Opcn

    Opcn Senior Member

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    I think about all of the gunk and all of the bits of weeds and critters that I've rinsed out of anchors since I was little (and that was my "job") and the thought of someone regularly hoisting anchor without that fills me with equal parts jealousy and worry.
  11. PacBlue

    PacBlue Senior Member

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    Anchoring in Florida skinny waters and the West coast of the US are two completely different things. Forget about 5/7/10 to 1 scopes for the average applications, lucky to get 3:1 in 75' - 100' water and that's why the use of all chain is so prevalent here. 5:1 is do able, but you will be a lot closer to shore, as the drop-offs are fairly steep. Storm situations are a different story.

    Descanso Bay in Catalina is a great test, as the skill level goes from the absolutely clue less to the most experienced. They pack as many boats as possibly in a small area. Without fail, the typically sail boater reads a book, tries to go 7 or 10:1 along with one boat length of chain, and ends up swinging across the entire anchorage.

    My favorite - we were anchored up nicely, a 42' SF comes in 3 - 4 boat lengths behind us, an attractive female mate in bikini sans deck shoes drops anchor, secures it, no fuss all business, they use all chain, they set-up in a few minutes and get whisked off to the island in less 30 minutes by the local water taxi (shoreboat). Not one issue as they knew what they were doing, later that night we both fend off three sailboats who have an unbelievable amount of scope out, and they were asking us to pull anchor and leave immediately in the dead of night. We politely informed them to take up some of there scope and the problem for the night was resolved.

    Anchor brand loyalty is like car brand loyalty, but out West never had a issue with an oversized Danforth and 300' of all chain rode, in wind gusts of 50+ mph (Pyramid Cove).
  12. Oscarvan

    Oscarvan Senior Member

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    On my previous boat (42' sail) the chain was unmarked. 100' of it. Don't care if I needed all of it or not and whether it just sat down there in a pile, overboard it went. The line was marked every 20 feet. It would go out as necessary. It was also a lot easier to belay on a cleat than the chain.